This comment was in a post about a guy who openly spilled secrets then got fired.

https://www.reddit.com/r/golf/comments/1dynric/rip_to_the_augusta_ama_guy_yesterday_who_was_not/

4 points

I think that I started using Reddit around 2014~5 or so. For me the cultural shift shows two things:

  1. Any online community financed by adbux will eventually prioritise advertisers over its own participants.
  2. Unless you have tools ensuring transparency of the process, people with power over the others’ speech will misuse it to defend their individual interests, instead of the community’s.
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154 points

To be fair, people stopped after starting a witch hunt for the Boston bombers and identifying the completely wrong people. It may very well be the case that they over corrected, but there is at least a good reason for the change overall. (also corporate interests I suppose, fuck them though)

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64 points

I’m not sure one has much to do with the other. I completely agree that the Boston bombing investigation was a witch hunt, no argument here. But witch hunts target individuals, and individuals are entitled to a certain degree of privacy which one would hope would protect them from an uninformed mob.

But airing your employers’ dirty laundry is whistle-blowing. It should be protected, especially if the industry secret is anti-consumer, dangerous, or illegal. And importantly, a corporation isn’t an individual, so they shouldn’t benefit from protections for individuals.

It’s tempting to think that we don’t see the Name and Shame posts actually naming and shaming because of Reddit’s interests with advertisers. But I think it’s also just as likely that users don’t want to be identified leaking secrets - likely due to the litigious nature of their employers.

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18 points

The problem is when it is weaponized by corporations to bypass competition or by activists who are upset for one reason and get everyone to rally for an untrue reason.

Example: McDonalds has an employee write about their horrible experience working for Burger King which is a complete fabrication to get people to hate their competitor.

Example 2: supporters for Presidential candidate John Smith don’t like that Target has been donating to Smith‘s rival political party. Smith supporters fabricate untrue stories about Target’s working conditions to get people to boycott the store and hurt profits. This would lead to less money being available for donations from the store.

In all honesty, I do think Name and Shame is perfectly reasonable and should be done. But I still want to highlight some ways that it can be abused. I don’t think Reddit should use this as an excuse to forbid the practice but Reddit should do due diligence in proving the story is right like verifying an employee’s employment at the company they are shaming, for example.

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12 points

Reddit also gets a lot of blame for shit that actually came out of 4chan in that case. Though reddit definitely amplified it.

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3 points

We did it, Reddit!

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32 points

Yeah, I remember… But I also remember nearly a decade of shills and astroturfing. Fuck Reddit.

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21 points
*

nearly a decade

It was the god damn 2016 election, wasn’t it? That’s the period when I noticed the rapid decline.

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10 points

For me, it became undeniable after the gamestop fiasco. I used to sub to wallstreetbets way back before all that. It was one of the last genuinely funny places on the internet. I’m lucky, i got in on those shares at £45 and sold at roughly somewhere round about £420.69.

After the day the price shot up to that, the place was just flooded with bots trying to get anyone to spend their money in any place but gamestop. You even had some mugs trying to short silver which, for anyone not in the know, you’d need about all the money in the world to do that.

But yeah, now, everything going on there is going to be ultra analysed by every fund in the world. Oh, they also fired all the admins and replaced them just before the flood gates opened.

I think its then that people saw the potential for flooding reddit with bots and shills.

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5 points

I remember there was an alt right leaning silver collecting sub shortly after. They were convinced it was going to shoot up a billion times in value. Like Gamestop was supposed.

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3 points

I think it was before that.

Reddit is commercials disguised as content. Political parties use ads/commercials to spread their message. 2016 I think was annoying and helped people to see it for what it is.

Like that one video of the girl jumping onto a trampoline. She drops down on it, comes up and when she comes up there’s an energy drink in the bottom corner facing the camera. Looks like a natural video but it’s a paid commercial that also didn’t pay reddit and therefore we all watched many commercials for free without the company paying for any server time, bug fixes or

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2 points

Bug fixes or… what Melvin? Bug fixes or what?!

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75 points
*

I just got a warning and [removed by reddit] because I told a dry cut story about turkish coworkers of mine harassing women and queer people and talking about stuff like “buying wifes” from their home country as an answer to someone posting a similar story. I got warned for “promoting hate and violence against marginalized groups”. I made no generelizations, promoted no violence or hate. I actually got upset because of my coworkers doing exactly that. This is not the internet as I know it. Where you get censored because you talked about something that happened in your life.

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47 points

As a Turkish person, ooph. Sorry you had to deal with that.

We’ve got some nice coming from Turkey, but also a bunch of shit heels. These days the latter outnumber the former, sadly.

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22 points

These days the latter outnumber the former, sadly.

It feels like that lately no matter where you happen to live.

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13 points

Every country has some shit people. It’s inevitable. Just gotta hope us good ones make it better.

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7 points

One of the nicest people I know is Turkish. We’ve never met in person, but we’ve been online friends for over 20 years. I wish people who stereotyped Turks when people act like this knew him.

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15 points

It’s been like that ever since China/Tencent invested. I noticed soon after that investment there was a huge degradation in freedom of speech on the platform.

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5 points

Because there is no discernable difference between you telling an honest story about your Turkish coworkers and a racist using online anonymity to rile people up against minorities.

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16 points
*

I think that should be decided by the readers of the comment not by reddit. Unless I actually incite hate or violence. Or maybe if I had a history of leaving comments like that. But it was the first time I talked about it. Or if my account was new or a bot. I don’t like to assume the worst about people just because they criticise something adjacent to a controversial topic. That’s how problems get swept under the rug and never solved.

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6 points
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Except if you leave it solely to the readers of the comment, the communications platform is still flooded by racists and bigots of all stripes. Sure, a lot of their comments are downvoted, but by giving them a platform you’re giving them a way to degrade the quality of the platform they’re on, drive away reasonable users and eventually take over and shit up the place unrestricted. Just like the nazi bar story.

Downvotes are nowhere near as effective as moderation when it comes to keeping hate off of a platform. Sorry if you posted something in good faith and moderation censored you, but that doesn’t make moderation as a concept wrong.

(Also, I kind of agree with you that there should be more signals available to moderators than just “does this comment mention race negatively”. However, I’m not sure you want reddit scoring what kind of person you are and attaching that score to every moderation action.)

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2 points
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Thank you for being reasonable and understanding how life isn’t black and white.

gets banned for using black and white

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1 point

Well not if you strip it from all context and the nuance of OPs specific word choice.

Because I could tell a story about my Turkish co-worker that ends like:

“my co-worker of specific race is doing dodgy shit and it’s so harmful for the whole community that he’s doing this, especially with how much anti-ethnic group hate is going around, he’s giving everyone a bad name and I’m worried his behaviour as an individual aashole who happens to be race is going to start a spree of hate crimes against others who aren’t doing anything wrong, because most people aren’t, my co-worker is”

And I would argue that this story is fundamentally different from just leaving it as “my Turkish co-worker is doing dodgy stuff”.

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I miss it. I came over right after Digg died, almost half a decade before 2010. Thought it was the ugliest site I had ever seen and found it super confusing.

People did largely speak their minds though, lots of controversial posts and uncensored humor, yeah it was nice, but the change in Reddit really mirrors general cultural changes too, it was more driven by Gen X and older millennials, more tech driven, and more what people would call edgy.

It was the wild west not so much because Reddit specifically was, but because that’s what broad tech bro Internet culture was. We also had relatively unmoderated Xbox Live and online gaming and other things that are hard to explain to folks now.

What we would call social media existed, Digg called it Social Bookmarking for a Digg / Reddit / Slashdot model. Myspace was just giving away to Facebook, Twitter was getting off the ground, and chat rooms, like Yahoo chatrooms and Geocities were so unhinged back then.

2005 is around the time that Yahoo started looking major ground to Google when just a few years prior it was the undisputed default search engine.

Neat to think about all this again.

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