Giving Up on Consciousness as the Ghost in the Machine(www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov)

Well reading it I’m not seeing any real studies or math or anything, just back and forth with people saying “Well it looks like we can’t find a soul anywhere, therefore without any real evidence consciousness is just an illusion and we as people don’t really exist, just sort of… believing we do because of brain juices.”

Which is the laughable position of eliminativism. Admittedly I didn’t read the whole thing, but I’m seeing names and quotes, I’m not seeing data.

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☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP

-1 points

2 months ago

Science consists of having a theory and testing the theory empirically. This work focuses on the theoretical model, and references numerous studies supporting their position.

therefore without any real evidence consciousness is just an illusion and we as people don’t really exist, just sort of… believing we do because of brain juices

That’s not what it says at all. What it’s actually saying is that what we perceive as consciousness is a byproduct of the subconscious and the likely evolutionary value of this construct is to facilitate social transfer of experience. It’s an argument against mind-body dualism which is itself a deeply unscientific concept.

Furthermore, the whole idea of a soul is laughably unscientific since it posits that there’s this magical entity that’s not an emergent property of the physical reality.

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Queen HawlSera@lemm.ee

1 point

2 months ago

I never said I was “For” the soul hypothesis, just that the way this read was “Well we know conciousness isn’t magic, so clearly it doesn’t exist at all in any meaningful way!” Which is… a leap at best.

And this answer seems like more materialist apologia masquerading as science. So we don’t exist, and the illusion that we do is so we can tell other people who don’t exist about how we’re not existing? You see why that’s dumb right?

And, how do we know there isn’t a non-physical reality from which this reality is itself an emergent property? That seems more likely than “People don’t REALLY exist”

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☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOP

-3 points

2 months ago

The soul is not a hypothesis. The idea has no basis in science. Period.

“Well we know conciousness isn’t magic, so clearly it doesn’t exist at all in any meaningful way!”

Again, not what the paper says. I get the impression that you didn’t actually read it, and just keep making straw man arguments here.

And, how do we know there isn’t a non-physical reality from which this reality is itself an emergent property? That seems more likely than “People don’t REALLY exist”

Empiricism is the basis for scientific method. Science doesn’t deal with hypothetical that cannot be measured using experimental means. The fact that you posit this suggests you don’t actually understand how scientific process actually works or what science is fundamentally.

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Queen HawlSera@lemm.ee

1 point

2 months ago

I never said the Soul was valid, you were the first one to say that “S-Word”
I did read it, it’s just quotes and names, no actual data… It’s hard for me to take seriously what’s essentially about as scientific as Joe Rogan talking to his Nazi of the week
“You disagreed with me, therefore you are dumb!” - I no longer see any reason to respond to this discussion.

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1 point

2 months ago

Removed by mod

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