NAS build, what's wrong with it?

posted 1 year ago

I want to setup a NAS (mainly for storing games and videos), that I’d also like to use to watch said videos on a WiFi TV and to install games on a separate PC connected via ethernet. This is the part list I came up with (plus whatever GPU I can get for as cheap as possible, I can probably get a ~~GT 730~~ GTX750 for free). I also don’t need it to be on 24/7, if that’s OK. I can place it in the same room as my main PC and hook it up to the same monitor to turn it on and start it up.

What’s wrong with it?

PCPartPicker Part List

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD Ryzen 3 3100 3.6 GHz Quad-Core Processor	$50.00
Motherboard	ASRock A520M-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard	$99.40
Memory	Kingston Server Premier 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR4-2666 CL19 Memory	$36.00
Memory	Kingston Server Premier 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR4-2666 CL19 Memory	$36.00
Storage	Samsung 860 Evo 250 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive	Purchased For $0.00
Storage	Seagate IronWolf NAS 4 TB 3.5" 5400 RPM Internal Hard Drive	$118.00
Storage	Seagate IronWolf NAS 4 TB 3.5" 5400 RPM Internal Hard Drive	$118.00
Video Card	Gigabyte GV-N750OC-1GI GeForce GTX 750 1 GB Video Card	Purchased For $0.00
Case	Fractal Design Node 304 Mini ITX Tower Case	$117.70
Power Supply	be quiet! Pure Power 11 CM 400 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply	$58.10
Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
Total	$633.20

PCPP says that R3 3100 isn’t compatible with the RAM I picked (although I can’t find why); it also says MoBo doesn’t support ECC RAM, but on the producer’s website it says it does (https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/A520M-ITXac/index.asp#Specification) , so I think PCPP is wrong.

I tried building around LGA 1150/1151 but motherboard prices are way higher (although CPU prices are lower).

I don’t think I can make it much cheaper than this, since I’m buying everything, but if you can point me in a cheaper direction, feel free to do so!

Thanks in advance

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[ - ]

satanmat@lemmy.world

3 points

1 year ago

Are you missing a boot drive?

I’d go for more drives but I’m a data slut

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mumei@lemmy.worldOP

2 points

1 year ago

Oh, that’s right. Nice catch! I can probably repurpose a 256GB SSD I have, can’t I? Should be enough for OS + utilities

The plan is to get more down the road, this is a starter setup! 4TB are enough for all my data at the moment, and the second drive is for backup; I will add a third drive for redundancy and that should be enough as a starter

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Transient Punk@sh.itjust.works

2 points

1 year ago

This may be a silly question, but why get a whole extra machine just to make 4tb available on the network? I have an old Linksys router with a USB port that allows you add USB storage to your network, that may be a good place to look if your needs are basic.

Additionally, it looks like you are going for a relatively powerful machine to be able to access a minimal amount of data at a slow speed. Have you considered just getting a couple of external hard drives and just hooking them up to a Raspberry Pi?

I don’t know where you’re located, but this seems to be a similar cost $104 (x2): https://www.amazon.com/Seagate-External-Recovery-Services-STKC4000400/dp/B08HMGXTFJ?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=ANMDN8YYOK06R

And a Raspberry Pi with 8gb of ram is $75: https://www.canakit.com/raspberry-pi-4-8gb.html?cid=usd&src=raspberrypi

Going the Raspberry Pi route would cost $288-$333 depending on accessories. This could be a really good route depending on what all you want to do.

Another way to save more would be to just add the drives to an existing desktop, and just setup samba/nfs to run on it. You’d just need to leave the desktop on all the time, or turn it on when you need to access it elsewhere.

Also, for reference, I have a NAS with 40tb of storage that I use as a VPS host. I have several virtual machines running 24/7, including a Plex server. I stream many videos locally, and have many users that access my content regularly. From what I’ve learned over the years of running that machine, I know that as long as you are just directly streaming the files, and not trying to transcode them, you don’t need hardly any processing power. I don’t have a GPU in my server, and don’t see a need to put one in. If your needs are really as simple as your post suggests, the raspberry pi route would be the way to go. It would also allow you to dip your toes into running a NAS, and see where your original build was lacking, and give you a better idea for what you want your next evolution to look like.

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mumei@lemmy.worldOP

1 point

1 year ago

Thanks for thd in-depth reply!

whole extra machine add to an existing desktop

It boils down to two things: inexperience (apparently 8GB of RAM might be enough? Just to name one issue wih my build haha) and I’ve already maxed out my main PC’s expansion slots.

I have a compact case, which is already housing two HDDs (a “landing” HDD, where I store and keep all the… Linux ISOs… until they reach a satisfactory ratio of upload, which has a 2y uptime and just recently encountered its first uncorrectable sector error, and a 2TB HDD where I keep my stuff, including the aforementioned… ISOs…, my GOG games and other media. This 2TB is backed up on a 2TB external drive, and it’s already full). Since this 2TB internal is full, I plan on moving some files to a different external HDD so I can stuff more things in it, but that leaves me with no backups for this stuff I want to move; this second external HDD is very small (650GB) so moving that stuff will make it full and I’ll have no chance to add onto that collection.

It’s a pretty unorganized situation and if I could get rid of all internal HDDs I could get rid of the HDD harness and fit a fan instead, also reduce noise.

In addition to this, I have yet to understand whether or not external drives can sustain “high” rates of writes (when I download GOG games, for example, it can easily add up to 100GB in a day) and reads (I usually seed… Linux ISOs… for tens to hundreds of GB a day). Of course these numbers arent’t for everyday, some days I download nothing for example, other days I don’t even turn on the PC.

powerful machine

And I even went for the cheapest parts I could get haha! Only way to make it less powerful is getting an Intel CPU, like the datahoarder wiki suggests, based on LGA 1150/1151, I can get one for like $20, but I can’t find used motherboards for a decent price, all around 130. That’s why I picked an AM4 platform: parts more widely available.

raspberry pi

Checked it out, unfortunately it’s out of stock in all the licensed retailers in my country. It does sound like a nice starting point, though, so I will keep an eye out for it to be restocked, but since it uses external drives I’m back to the previous question: are external drives sturdy enough to sustain the amount of data I write and read daily?

no GPU

Wait, how can you turn it on and configure eveything necessary on it without graphics? Is it all done remotely via a main machine?

Sorry for the wall of text! And thanks again for the help!

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Transient Punk@sh.itjust.works

2 points

1 year ago

Okay, I feel like I have a better idea of what you’re looking for now.

Unless you’re using some sort of shingled drive, reads from the magnetic platter should be non-destructive, so reading files for seeding shouldn’t do much to the drives in terms of wear and tear.

External drives are fine for durability, and if you get them from a reputable company I’m sure you’ll be happy with them. Buying cheap, high capacity external drives and shucking them is a common tactic that some data hoarders will use to get the most bang for their buck. Remember that external HDDs are going to be subject to more stresses than a normal drive (people moving them while they’re on, etc), so it wouldn’t be in the best interest of the manufacturer to make them less durable than regular HDDs. You just have to keep in mind that HDDs are mechanical in nature. Anything with moving parts will wear down over time and eventually break. Typically you should expect to cycle through your drives every 4 years or so (I say this while never having cycled any of my drives and they are all working fine).

I see you also keep picking drives that have NAS in the name, just so you know, that’s mostly marketing bullshit. They name the drives with different use cases so they can charge more for them and get that little bit of extra profit. There’s very little that can be done to tune the drives firmware for those different use cases. So, just get the most capacity your can afford from the company you want to use, and don’t worry about it it has NAS in the name.

You’re going to want more storage capacity, so don’t lock yourself down with a tiny case like the Node 304. Get a case that can hold a lot of HDDs. I went with the Node 804, which has mounting spots for 8 HDDs and two 2.5" SSDs (more spots than that when you realize that SSDs have no moving parts, so it doesn’t matter where you put them). I ended buying a new bigger case within a year of building my NAS, so definitely leave yourself room to grow, it may cost more up front, but will save you money in the long term.

As far as the GPU goes, I initially got a Ryzen 3400G, which is an APU, so I just used the integrated graphics. Since then, (remember how I bought a new case within a year?) I have upgraded the CPU to a Ryzen 3800x without onboard graphics, and I am now using this motherboard, which has onboard graphics, as well as IPMI. The IPMI is amazing, and I highly recommend it; it’s allowed me to have the computer in a remote location far away from any monitors, and it only has Ethernet cables and a power cable connected.

As far as other options goes, you could also get a bigger case for the computer you already have, that would allow you to add more storage. You could also get a very large SATA SSD (I just saw an 8tb one for ~$340), and you could just shove that into your current case anywhere to hold you over until you save up to get a more dedicated build going.

This is a decent podcast series on all things self hosted, you may be able to learn a lot from it: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUW3LUwQvegxit4XMxUNW3qrRFmgP_aaT

Apologies for the wall of text. I hope it’s been helpful.

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mumei@lemmy.worldOP

2 points

1 year ago

Apologies for the wall of text

Not at all, rather thank you!

I researched again for parts and, whichever way I go, it’s all very expensive.

The “cheaper” options are still expensive considered the lack of expandability: I can get, for example, two 3.5" 4TB drives for around 90-100 each, or, slightly better, two 2.5" 4TB drives for around 120-130 each; the 2.5" drives would allow me to get rid of the HDD cage in my PC and mount a fan in its place. Either way, 8TB (actually 4TB + mirrored backup) for 200-250, and I can’t expand it further.

Slightly more expensive: a one drive Synology NAS, for around 300 (including a 4TB HDD, bought separately); again, locked with no further scaling possible.

Then, a two drives Synology NAS, for 450-500 (including two 4TB drives, bought separately), no scaling. But it’s getting closer to my needs.

Finally, a four drives Synology NAS, definitely fitting for my needs, which is 500 not including drives; once I add storage, for example just two 8TB drives (to which I’d add another two down the road), I’m close to 800 (and this is by getting the cheapest 8TB drive I can find, nothing with “NAS” in the name haha).

Shucking isn’t really a financially good option, it looks like, since external drives are actually more expensive in my country.

tiny case

Well, the Node 304 can hold six drives. Realistically, that should be enough for me even if I decide to have two backups (so using two drives for storage and then the other four just to back up those two) and even if I get 8TB drives (at the moment I have just shy of 3TB of data and I think i can easily add another 2TB onto it, but further than that… not sure). Worst case scenario changing only the case is pretty painless, especially if I can sell the old one to buy the larger one.

gpu

Yeah, I know I can get an APU, issue is, with that MoBo I picked only PRO APUs support ECC RAM. For what I understand, ECC RAM, while not mandatory, is highly recommended. The data I have is not vital, but if I can avoid corruption and having to download it again, I’d rather do so. To be fair, I’m currently not using ECC RAM and I haven’t encountered data corruption in the past two or three years… so I’m a bit torn on this point now

your config

That’s a very expensive motherboard, wow! I can’t find it for less than 350! Definitely over budget for me at the moment

larger case for my current setup

This is definitely something I’ll consider, at least as a stopgap until I can build a proper NAS. This way would allow me to have many drives and I could also repurpose the ones I already have.

I think I’ll have to put this project on hold for now haha but thanks for the huge help, I’ll definitely watch that video in the meantime!

Thanks again!

edit: looks like I can shave off another 100 from the planned build, since I can get a CPU (Ryzen 5 2600) and a 550W PSU for free. Which is actually not bad. Remove one stick of RAM, since 8GB should be enough, and I can save another 30, bringing the total to around 500. Not that bad as a start! Actually, bring that back to 600, since it would make more sense to get 8TB drives since I’m already around 3TB. Still, saved money is money saved haha

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Transient Punk@sh.itjust.works

2 points

1 year ago

I’m really happy you’re looking at all your options. Running a homelab/nas can be a lot of fun, but, you’re right, it’s expensive, but you can turn what you learn from it into potential career advancements, so it could pay for itself.

Best of luck!

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