i didn’t ask why you were bringing up people who aren’t here after the fact in response to your statement that on lemmy it was probably okay, i asked it in response to your claim that you were referring to all the different people who would respond to my post. i was asking it because after a month, only you had responded to my post and we had a perfectly fine conversation. even looking at the votes there was no indication that anyone had a problem with my comments.
in direct response to it being likely fine i asked if all this was based on the assumption that i’d talk this way everywhere.
I was asking those questions because it seemed like you were trying to construct a situation where your reasoning held but i didn’t want to make that assumption and accuse you of that so i asked you to elaborate instead.
I wasn’t able to find any variant of “white people bad” in the top comment. if you can point it out that would help me understand. i’ll quote the entire comment here so you don’t have to go looking:
Anytime I hear people say dumb shit like this I just start listing all the times anti-abortion activists either successfully murdered or attempted to murder their political opponents in the name of the pro life movement. A hit list of judges, physicians, nuns, retired old ladies that like to knit, they absolutely didn’t give a single fuck about any of this struggle session bullshit wreckers like to trot out to sabotage effective resistance
Then I end with the date Roe got overturned, but they still somehow cannot connect the dots and want to talk about registering new voters or some fucking bullshit
My take home message is it turns out that when white people actually want something they magically know what effective forms of protest actually look like (???!)
your formatting and structure wasn’t what made me think you were the one who felt attacked and repulsed, it was your use of offensive stereotypes when describing a person i actually needed to orient my responses and thought towards. what i’m specifically referring to is using broken english and invoking “billy the inbred”.
later on, your continued suggestion that people on other social media sites and who would read my comments would respond badly to “white people bad” combined with the fact that I couldn’t find any example of it in the top comment made me think you were bringing something you disagreed with into the conversation and trying to put it on someone else to make space to talk about it (think someone who blames something incidental on a political issue or party: I stub my toe and blame the reTHUGlicans, etc), which dovetails with the idea that its actually you who has some problem with the rhetoric.
but it would have been insulting to assume the worst so i asked questions instead to gain a better understanding.
Edit/tldr: The topic could not have been more meta, and instead of treating it as a meta commentary; you acted like you took it literally and behaved as if I was throwing up strawmen or secretly disagreeing with you. This is why I scoff at the idea that you want me to think this is a conversation, when that was very clearly never your intent.
Can you tell me where I brought up other social media platforms? Because if you had read what I wrote you’d have seen that it was immediately after talking about how others would perceive your post.
To put it simply, I think statements like “yt people bad” or any of the variants are too reductive for their explanations to ultimately matter, regardless of merit.
Nothing about what I’ve said has deviated from this message.
By the way, no I chose my words carefully. I never stated that this post or these comments would be seen on other platforms. It seems like the only issue you have with what I’ve said is that I didn’t preface it with “If you speak like this on other platforms.”.
Beyond which, you realize that before this conversation it wasn’t like I was totally unaware of what oppression was? It’s not like I lived in a bubble, I just don’t like how conversations about this topic always become racially charged despite that never being the real problem.
It’s funny to me that you refer to any of this as a “conversation”. Obfuscating my points by conflating both of my subjects (you and the person who sparked the thread), being “confused” despite the fact that I was very clear with my words, arbitrarily deciding that I must just disagree that oppression is real; all of these things point to debatelord tactics. I am mortified for the people you speak to regularly if this is the shit you put them through during “conversation”.
Lastly, what point is there in trying to refine the opinion of someone who is already aligned morally with you? Why, if we’ve come to a point where we have an understanding, would you point fingers and act as if anything other than complete acceptance of your message is incorrect? Why is there no room for refinement of your perspective? What makes you think that this is any kind of meaningful discourse? Especially when you take into consideration that your response implies that you don’t speak like this on other platforms?
your reference directly to other platforms:
On literally any platform with a sizeable userbase (lurkers)? Absolutely not, the net result is ultimately in favor of polarization.
and later on, clarifying that this was in reference to social media platforms:
Yes, I addressed this. If you’d read what I said, I very clearly stated that on Lemmy it’s likely fine. On any major social media site, it isn’t.
and to your point i did notice that you said that in reference to how people not on lemmy would respond to a post on lemmy. the underlying assumption that i would use the same language reasoning and approach on a different platform is doing a lot of heavy lifting there. people post differently in different places and frankly they probably don’t go 20 replies deep over it in most.
but that’s not at all my only issue or misunderstanding with what youve written.
I don’t think you’ve deviated from your message, i’m trying to understand why you brought it up in the first place when the top commenter didn’t ever say it. i’m trying my best to do so by asking you what you think as opposed to making assumptions and putting words in your mouth.
am i correct in saying that the topic in question that you don’t like becoming racially charged when race is never the real problem with it is how teaching that social change is achieved by being reasonable is a form of whitewashed history?
Do you think Lemmy has a sizeable userbase compared to other platforms? Because I don’t. It’s grown considerably, that does not make it large enough to be directly compared to something like Reddit, Xitter etc.
My only comment to your next point is: why try to convince others that are morally aligned with you? Why waste your time talking to people who won’t disagree with you?
I brought it up in the first place as a meta commentary on how threads like this are perceived on larger platforms. This is not the first time a debate like this has happened, it will not be the last. I was merely examining how something like a reductive statement can backfire unintentionally.
For example, I agreed with everything the original commenter stated. Right up until they brought up how “white people suddenly know how to protest when yadayada”. This statement is what I’m talking about when I say “yt people bad or variants of”. Granted, with explanation the statement makes perfect sense. Without explanation, as is the inevitable conclusion of most reductive statements, sparked the talk about lurkers.
am i correct in saying that the topic in question that you don’t like becoming racially charged when race is never the real problem with it is how teaching that social change is achieved by being reasonable is a form of whitewashed history
You aren’t correct until you make this paragraph make sense. I’m not implying you should be reasonable with fascists.
In response to your edits: I don’t think we’re morally aligned and I don’t think the average person is incapable of understanding that “white people bad” doesn’t mean white people are bad because of their skin color but instead means that the position they occupy in society is bad.
Where did I decide you believe oppression isn’t real?
If it’s driving you up the wall this much, stop replying. Click the check mark instead of the link and don’t worry about it.
You think that the average person, keep in mind the average person in the United States reads around a 6th to 8th* grade level, will read further than white people bad? That, my good person, is blind optimism.
I’m starting to think you disagree and feel attacked and repulsed y my rhetoric
Idk, maybe when you wrote this.
*Edited for accuracy.