“If I were a teacher I could give to shit’s if students cheated if they learned the material.”

Oh, the irony😂, do we tell him?

Sounds like they didn’t learn the material though. If they had learned it they would have noticed it would fail when graded by a human.

you collaborate and work with people to help you both understand.

If it’s a group assignment, sure. But if some contractors decide to work together instead of being competitors, that’s hugely illegal and fraudulent. If two random people from two different governments decide to pool their work together, that’s possibly treason.

Anecdotal but I have a team of devs under me, cheating is definitely still a thing in industry. Some people copy other people’s work and claim it as their own and they are weak devs. I could teach them, but when it gets close to micromanaging I have to let them go due to poor performance.

Many of them don’t grow up. Be an adult. I hire people based on how teachable they are. Cheating cheapens that.

The point of a degree is that the individual is certified at having a certain level of ability in a specific field. How is a student supposed to regularly demonstrate they understand the material in a format that is workable with one teacher, a few TAs, and a hundred students? Would the degree be an accurate endorsement if they passed all their classes by cheating?

There’s often modules to work collaboratively for this very reason.

The point of this module will have been to learn and understand the material, which will also have been the point of the assignment.

Also, on the cheating not being a thing outside of real life point. a) it is - there are lots of things you can cheat at which is against the rules. Stealing for example could be considered cheating as you haven’t earnt the item you’re stealing. b) uni/college is not there to teach you real life. It’s there to provide you the materials to learn a subject. Don’t want to use those materials and learn? Well then you probably just shouldn’t be there.

If I were a teacher I could give two shit’s if students cheated if they learned the material.

If the code they copied from github worked with the sample data provided but failed in most other cases it’s safe to say they didn’t learn the material, or didn’t care enough to actually read the code they were submitting.

“cheating” is almost not a thing outside of school.

They are supposed to know how to program. All these students had to do was to fix the code they copied. In the outside world that’s the difference between having a job and getting fired for being an incompetent ass.

“cheating” is almost not a thing outside of school.

Ever heard of scams? Fraud? Legal loopholes? All those white collar crimes that people somehow manage to get away with? Or, more importantly, plagiarism?

I know, “only plagiarism is similar, none of the other things is about copying someone else’s work”. True. But all of them are about not getting caught.

Also, specifically for programming, you can cheat if you’re “smart” enough, by simply outsourcing your job and claiming it’s all your work.

you collaborate and work with people to help you and them understand. It’s crazy that showing someone the answers and explaining said answer to them is considered cheating. And because the very act of sharing your work is villainized these students have never been taught how to properly work collaboratively outside of just sharing answers. It’s absolutely ridiculous.

This, I fully agree with. Humanity didn’t get here with people learning and memorizing shit by themselves, never asking for help. It’s always been about sharing knowledge, collaborating for a goal that’s impossible at the individual level. Most education systems completely fail to teach collaboration.

Just to clarify what? You can certainly develop code without a CS degree, but there are tons of useful and fascinating ideas found in CS programs that “wolfling” devs are only haphazardly exposed to.