The Israeli government on Monday screened for 200 members of the foreign press some 43 minutes of harrowing scenes of murder, torture and decapitation from Hamas’s October 7 onslaught on southern Israel, in which over 1,400 people were killed, including raw videos from the terrorists’ bodycams.
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The footage was collected from call recordings, security cameras, Hamas terrorists’ body cameras, victim dashboard cameras, Hamas and victims’ social media accounts, and cellphone videos taken by terrorists, victims and first responders. Over 1,000 civilians were slaughtered by the terrorists, and at least 224 people were abducted.
In semi-related news, the IDF claim to be holding over 1000 bodies of Hamas terrorists who entered Israeli territory on October 7th.
Wow, that must have been really hard to watch.
When you have a bunch of online edgelords constantly denying atrocities, this is what’s necessary, and I definitely applaud the journalists for having the stomach to watch this kind of stuff so that I don’t have to.
And before someone brings it up, I know it’s frustrating that truth is hard to reliably determine in war, but if your position really hinges on whether the neck of a murdered baby is intact or not, the plot has been thoroughly and utterly lost. And there are photos of burnt and bloodied dead children out there if you really care to look.
Cool, now let’s see the bodycam footage from IDF soldiers.
Oh, that doesn’t fill a propaganda purpose to show IDF soldiers killing civilians and children, does it?
Hey, here’s a thought: there is no number of civilians killed by a terrorist organization that can justify the gov’t killing of thousands of civilians and non-combatants. If Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorists for murdering Israelis, then so is the whole fucking gov’t of Israel for murdering Palestinian non-combatants with indiscriminate bombing.
To expand on this, if you knew that there was a murderer in a crowd of 20 people, would you say that the gov’t had the right and duty to mow down that crowd with machine gun fire in order to prevent that person from killing again? Because that’s what the Israeli gov’t is doing.
If Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorists for murdering Israelis, then so is the whole fucking gov’t of Israel for murdering Palestinian non-combatants with indiscriminate bombing.
And with the big difference that no one is asking the west to support Hamas, they’re already labeled terrorists and heavily restricted, while the government of Israel wants to maintain pleasant status within the world while still doing terrorism.
“To expand on this, if you knew that there was a murderer in a crowd of 20 people, would you say that the gov’t had the right and duty to mow down that crowd with machine gun fire in order to prevent that person from killing again? Because that’s what the Israeli gov’t is doing.”
I don’t feel like these morality questions do anything for anybody. It’s basically a dog whistle for anyone who agrees with you because there ARE people who would mow down 20 to catch 1 killer. These idiots exist, otherwise we wouldn’t be here.
If Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorists for murdering Israelis, then so is the whole fucking gov’t of Israel for murdering Palestinian non-combatants with indiscriminate bombing.
If there was indiscriminate bombing, the Gaza Strip would be gone already and they would use bunker buster bombs to destroy the tunnels.
So what do you suggest that Israel should do with the constant rocket attacks still coming from Gaza? Are they supposed to ignore the continuous attacks on their civilians?
Israel also made Hamas an offer: Release all hostages and turn in the terrorists that committed the massacres on October 7th.
If there was indiscriminate bombing
So it’s targeted bombing that has killed 2500 children so far in this past two weeks? You’re saying that Israel is intentionally targeting children? You realize that’s worse, right?
I’d suggest that they return the land that they stole from Palestinians, dismantle the settlements and outposts on occupied land, and end the blockades in Gaza. And then punish their citizens that attacks Palestinians, burn Palestinian homes and olive groves, and seize Palestinian land. And hey!, maybe gave Palestinians a real vote in the knesset, since they seem so opposed to a two-state solution. As it stands, the overwhelming majority of Palestinians do not have a say in their own governance.
Are Palestinians supposed to ignore the constant attacks against them by Israelis, and by the IDF? Why do you expect Palestinians to turn the other cheek, but not Israel?
You take power from Hamas by giving the people what the people want, and what they deserve. You remove their cause of action from them. You agree to their reasonable demands, and you share power with them. You try to correct the historic injustices perpetuated against them by the Israeli government.
But Israel won’t do that, because the far-right politicians that are in power–and the majority of the people that keep voting them into power–equate anything that is anti-Zionist to being anti-semitic.
We see this same thing in the US with black people, with Native Americans. When they protest peacefully, they’re ignored. When they protest violently, they’re thugs and murderers. There’s never any real interest by those in power in correcting the injustices that led to the protests in the first place.
I dont want to defend Israel BUT, let’s do a small thought experiment. If you could snap your fingers and reverse the roles, give Hamas the military power of Israel, what do you think Hamas would do? Do you think they would do worse things than Israel currently does? The same? Better?
It is very obvious that Israel is holding back. Not because they give a fuck about the palestinians but because they care about the political fallout.
I’d suggest that they return the land that they stole from Palestinians, dismantle the settlements and outposts on occupied land, and end the blockades in Gaza. And then punish their citizens that attacks Palestinians, burn Palestinian homes and olive groves, and seize Palestinian land. And hey!, maybe gave Palestinians a real vote in the knesset, since they seem so opposed to a two-state solution. As it stands, the overwhelming majority of Palestinians do not have a say in their own governance.
So your plan is to reward the palestinians for their attack? And you think this is a likely outcome? Do you think there is a single country who would do that? Of course not. All these are good suggestions and a position to have. But this attack by its nature will delay any peaceful solution for at least a decade.
Also the devil is in the details. What do you mean by “returning” the land? Which land? Because for many people, the stolen land is the entirety of Israel. Which is why Hamas’ goal is the destruction of Israel. Israel cant be charitable towards entities whose main purpose is Israel’s destruction, especially while having the holocaust ptsd.
So before we go into the nitty gritty details of a solution, let’s start with some basic and somewhat meaningless gestures. Like for example the palestinians accepting the existence of Israel in Palestine(region). And then we can talk about israeli settlements and settlers and which of these need to be returned to Palestine(state) and how.
We see this same thing in the US with black people, with Native Americans. When they protest peacefully, they’re ignored. When they protest violently, they’re thugs and murderers.
Do you think black people got rights in the US because of black people violence? Violence can accelerate things but it can also delay them. Imagine if Black Panthers indiscriminately killed 1000 white people, while kidnapping hundreds in the 60s. Do you think that would have led to more racial equality?
Or would that event have delayed racial equality for decades?
But Israel won’t do that, because the far-right politicians that are in power–and the majority of the people that keep voting them into power–equate anything that is anti-Zionist to being anti-semitic.
You are not wrong but you do realize that this attack only empowered the right wing israelis, right? It’s harder to convince your average israeli to be charitable and care about palestinian human rights after what Hamas did.
This is deliberate. Hamas wanted things to escalate. Because Hamas is funded by Iran. Saudi Arabia(KSA) and Israel were about to become best friends forever(well their governments, saudis still hate Israel), because MBS wanted to make his shiny city(NEOM).
As part of that deal, the US would also sign security deals with both Israel and KSA, similar to the ones it has with Japan and South Korea. And Israel would give back to Palestine(state) some israeli settlements, so that MBS would have something to justify the deal.
But Iran doesnt want KSA/Israel to become stronger/more stable, so they nuked this relationship by getting Hamas to do what they did. Not all powers want stability and peace. Some powers think that the current situation is fucked/unfair and they want to keep the world in flux in order to have a chance “to make things right”. There is a reason why Russia keeps talking about a new world order and have allies like Iran and North Korea. China isnt happy either but they also not necessarily willing to risk the current status quo.
Utilitarianism would lead you to that decision, you can justify any atrocity with it.
And here we are, in the west, justifying the atrocities that Israel is committing, has committed in the past, and will likely commit in the future, because Hamas manages to commit significantly lesser atrocities. We applaud the disproportionate responses of Israel, while condemning Hamas. We then also applaud the provocations of Israel, and condemn the responses of Hamas.
…And, of course, we pretend that Israel didn’t create Hamas, because they were afraid of the growing political power of Fatah and the PLO, and the calls for a two-state solution. Kinda like how the US created what became the Taliban by funding the mujahideen…
IDF claim to be holding over 1000 bodies of Hamas terrorists who entered Israeli territory on October 7th.
This claim doesn’t appear to be in your article. I’ve been looking for a source about the estimated number of Hamas that entered on the 7th.
I think I found it.
They seem to let you link to the correct place if you use the share button:
He added that Israel was holding more than 1,000 Hamas militants, both dead and alive.
If Israel has 1000, I wonder how many went back to Gaza after the attack. It’s probably sizeable given how many hostages they had.
I’ve seen a few estimates. Some sources have said 1,500. The one I saw today was reported on Channel 12’s live feed (hebrew warning) reported at 10:45.
Google translate spits out:
In addition to this, the IDF spokesman noted that the army has over a thousand dead bodies and prisoners among the Hamas terrorists, and that “this figure indicates the nature of the fighting in the Otef, the heroism of the fighters, civilians and the standby units.” Brigadier General Hagari added that 14 trucks with aid were brought into the Strip Humanitarian, where the emphasis is that fuel does not enter the strip. In the northern sector, the IDF eliminated eight terrorist squads that tried to launch anti-tank missiles in the last day. Since the beginning of the fighting, 20 terrorist squads of Hezbollah have been eliminated.
did hamas do israel a propaganda favor? they needed one. fuck them both, murderous dickbags
The IDF is desperate to change the narrative from the fact that the bombings have murdered 5000 Palestinians.
The number given by the same Hamas health dept that said Israel killed 500 when they bombed a hospital? Even though it wasn’t Israel, it wasn’t the hospital, and it wasn’t nearly 500 people?
I’m sure a lot have died. And definitely too many civilians. And from where I sit, I’d think Israel should do at least some things differently. But if the hospital situation taught us nothing else, it should have taught us to not quote stuff from Hamas without another source.
