Thoughts? I live in a wintery biome so having awd gives me a bit of peace of mind
I think I agree with you. The author mentions AWD in snow as a minor passing thing in a way you can tell they haven’t lived somewhere with it.
But that said I haven’t driven an EV and I’d be worried about the extra direct torque they can provide making starting on ice or snowpack more difficult and dangerous.
I’ve owned two EVs, and that instant torque is much more of a pro than a con, even in the snow. Think about traction control: when the computer detects a loss of traction, it cuts power to the motor until it detects traction has been regained. In a gas powered car, you can really only change the flow of gas a couple times per second, because there’s some delay between applying throttle, waiting for ignition, etc. But in an EV, you can modulate the power upwards of a thousand times per second, and it gets applied to the wheels practically instantly. So when you slip in the snow, the traction control can react far faster.
My first EV was RWD and I would say that winter performance was comparable to my FWD sedans that I drove before, because the weight is distributed much more evenly, and that traction control is amazing.
My current EV is AWD and even on all season tires, it’s insane. Obviously no powertrain helps you stop if you don’t have snow tires, but for starting off in rough traction, it’s insane. Comparing my car to our Honda CRV, it’s wildly different. I can basically drive the car like there’s no snow on the ground (except I leave a massive gap in front in case I need to stop). The CRV slides all over the place
Sorry for rambling, I’m just a bit of an EV evangelist, and snow is somewhere that they really shine
My experience has been that on steep, snowy roads heavy EVs struggle. It could have been that they all had the wrong tires but going up Berthoud pass I’ve seen a handful of Tesla Ys and Xs doing their best Tokyo drift impressions trying to just get up the hill - virtually zero traction and sideways struggling to even stay moving much less staying in their lane
I will say my FWD EV isn’t as good in snow as my old AWD/4×4 Jeep, or even my old Ford Taurus. I do notice the extra weight in snow, and the centre of gravity is closer to the battery pack, not the “engine”, at least middle not front. I think a RWD EV might be a little better.
Still, just drive to the conditions. I’m not going to cross the Coquihalla or the Malahat in winter conditions either.
Yeah, heavy cars definitely do worse in general, especially if they’re on shitty tires. I’d love to get snow tires but we only get two or three days a year where the weather is bad enough to justify them, and they’re too damn expensive, so we just stay home when the roads are bad
That’s only half of what traction control is. The other half is applying the brake to the slipping wheel to divert power back through the differential to the stuck wheel. That braking control is electric, and while I don’t think it operates with PWM, it can be applied many times per second.
Depends where you live with lots of snow. If you’re not emergency personnel and you live in a major metropolitan area with good salting and plowing? You absolutely do not need AWD. If you’re like in the GTA or the Chicago sprawl you’ll be fine - make sure to pick up your groceries the day before the blizzard. Any day where the roads are bad-enough to need an all-terrain vehicle, everything will be closed anyways. The only urban places I’d be tempted by AWD would be the Prairies Provinces, where they sometimes get snow below -10C (usually it’s bone dry here in Ontario when it gets below -10C) and salt can’t melt that so they just dump in some grit and hope. At least it’s pretty flat there.
However, if you live rural? Absolutely. My in-laws live in a hilly rural area and I’ve tried visiting them in an FWD minivan in the winter. Do not recommend.
I’ve driven an EV for five years and made a 50km daily one way commute over rural, highway and city streets for 15 years. I live in Canada and we get snow , freezing rain and more weather. In my experience good driving habits > AWD all day everyday.
Pay attention to the road conditions, don’t drive faster than the weather will allow, get winter tires, keep your brakes maintained, drive a safe speed even when others are impatient, leave room to stop, if the weather is bad enough don’t leave at all, if you must leave plan to leave early enough that you aren’t tempted to make bad driving decisions such as speeding. This isn’t rocket science, but over the last 15 years and 540,000 km I have seen several impatient people pass me in the winter weather just to end up seeing them again in the ditch within 10 minutes. That includes 1 4x4 truck, 1 AWD SUV and at least 2 sedans.
The Bros in the truck all had to climb out the passenger side since it landed on its drivers side, the lady in the SUV was stuck down in the gutter and told me not to worry, she’d call a tow, and in the case of one sedan I ended up driving this small family home, car seat and all. Will AWD help you get yourself out of a slick parking spot, or start up at a red light? Sure, maybe, it depends. But it isn’t really going to help with much else and doesn’t come close to just learning to drive to the conditions.
Adding to this, AWD gives people a false sense of security and often leads to riskier driving behavior. It’s just like you said, there is absolutely no substitute for knowing how to handle difficult road conditions, anything that extends your confidence beyond your ability is dangerous.
I use all season tires year round. Unless you live in a very remote or hot part of the world: anytime it snows the city/county/state brings out the plows and salt and cleans the road. Yes winter tires are better on ice, but in reality you are almost never driving on ice anyway so it doesn’t make much a difference. Just slow down when it is icy and summer tires are fine. And you need to do that anyway because winter tires are better, but they are not perfect.
Are you saying 2wd is safer than awd?
If good driving skill is equal, I mean.
Edit: since bluegill blocked me, ill update here… the argument could then be extended to saying summer tires is safer because it reminds you how bad things are, too
You mentioned in another thread to use all seasons instead of winter tires, so I won’t take safety advice from you on anything to be honest.
What do you mean by “good driving skill?” Humans almost all get over confident if they don’t get constant feedback that things are slippery, so 2wd with the constant reminder that things are bad will give you that feedback and thus you drive slower, which in turn makes it seem like you are a better driver who doesn’t get overconfident.
If you can avoid the over confidence problem and drive as slow as conditions demand, AWD is better because when you must stop at an intersect you can accelerate out of the stop sign faster and thus clear the intersection before the next idiot going too fast slides around a blind corner and into it. However I have no confidence that you can avoid that over confidence and so 2wd is safer because most of the time you are not in an intersection.
I didn’t block you, I don’t know what you mean, I’m also not the person who uses all seasons.
I’d think AWD is for traction, not ‘the track’.
I’ve owned several FWD EVs in what I’d consider the wintery parts of BC (snowfall of 8+ meters anually) and the amount of times I got stuck as a result of not having AWD can be counted on one hand. Good driving habits and high-end winter tires are much, much more important than having AWD or not.
That said, the times I did get stuck were mostly a bit annoying if not embarassing (due to holding up traffic). Only once (while climbing a steep hill) did it actually get a bit sketchy due to backsliding, but that happened to every vehicle that had to come to a stop on that hill.
I mean, doesn’t that depend on the cost?
If it was $100 increase to avoid that, sure.
But if it’s significantly more, then I’ll take the cheaper car.
Yes sure, but not at any cost. Not only are they generally more expensive to own, insure, and maintain, AWD adds weight to a vehicle which makes it harder to stop. The best winter car I’ve ever owned to this day is still a small Fiat Panda. It was FWD and tiny, but importantly very light and with all the primary weight over the driven wheels. With good (studded) winter tires it got up hills in snow where my wife’s AWD SUV was struggling.
I live in Minnesota. While AWD isn’t a necessity, it is really great to have. My AWD ID.4 is amazing in the snow and ice. I didn’t read great things about the RWD winter handling. The extra acceleration/speed is fun, but I bought AWD for winter driving
Like greater Minneapolis–Saint Paul area or rural? I live in Southern Ontario and while we get bad blizzards, the GTA has such good salting and plowing I never find I’m worried about traction. But I know it does get worse winter in Minnesota, particularly if you’re in a rural area where there’s less road maintenance.
Depending on where in Southern Ontario you live, there is a chance you live North of Minneapolis St Paul. There is also a good chance that the great lakes make your climate more mild as well.
Of course Ontario is big. If you go directly north from Minneapolis you end up in Ontario - but almost nobody lives in that part of Ontario.