I don’t care what religion it is, I just want more holidays
How about holidays because humans are living, breathing, thinking, emoting beings that need decent food, shelter, rest and recreation? The closing of businesses on at least one weekend day need not be religious. If we run oit for a day or two, we get some from a neighbor or are just out for a day or two?
hear me out, i may be less for adding more religious holidays.
this is based on trying to use b and h as a professional service. they close for EVERY Jewish holiday. there’s so many of them. so many more then Christian holidays that others close for. AND they still close for those Christian holidays.
it makes them unpredictable and hard to use. if they also started taking off Muslim holidays they’d be closed every 2 days… that’s just too much. i don’t think we as a society can afford to take that many holidays.
it’s very hard to explain to you boss why we have to delay because the partner we’re contracted with is closed until Monday because of a holiday that your boss has never heard of.
This would be my argument for allowing people of various religions to take their religious holidays, but not require everyone to take them (if they don’t want to).
So (and these will all be hypothetical because my knowledge of holidays across various religions is pretty poor – sorry) :-
Imagine there are four main religions in the UK – Potterism, Everdinery, Swannism and Sherlockian.
Potterism celebrates the 31st of July, 31st of October, the 2nd of May, the 1st of September and the 19th of September as its holy days.
Everdinery celebrates the 10th of March, the 20th of May, the 31st of August, the 9th of January and the 5th of July.
Swannism celebrates the 3rd to the 5th of May, the 10th of August, the 12th of September and the 12th of December.
And Sherlockian celebrates the 1st of February, the 9th of March, the 12th of June, the 24th of September and the 10th of October.
Along with all these, all four religions celebrate the 31st of December, the 1st of January and the 23rd of August. Just because.
(Really making this up as I ago along).
The celebrants of each religion can take their days off as a holiday (without using up their paid holiday allowance), but businesses do not have to close. Bank holidays become a thing of the past.
Schools ignore them, and school holidays are arranged around more sensible times (summer holidays, spring holidays, winter holidays).
Religion is taken out of public life more or less altogether.
Now I accept that in “real life” this will be more complicated, but businesses can adapt for Jewish, Muslim, Christian and other workers and would not need to shut down on such a wide scope
The only exception might still be Christmas, because that has become more of a secular thing than a religious one.
I listened to an interesting podcast about something like this, it might have been on 'cautionary tales '. Apparently at one point some Soviet area tried organising everyone’s days off in shifts instead of everyone taking Sunday off and factories lying idle. Basically tho you actually loose a lot of the social value of days off if you don’t get them at the same time as other people. Can’t visit your family or friends unless they have the same day off as you, for example. And what if your kid’s school’s day off isn’t the same as yours?
I want a whole fucking week off like India, how come they get to do that and we can’t?
I was under an incorrect assumption, looked it up. Coulda swore some nation had a week long holiday for a national celebration…
I don’t even want more holidays. I just want them spaced out better :)
(Every public holiday bar 1 occurs within 22 weeks and 1 day (December 25th to the 27th of May in this case).
They all occur within the last week of December, the first week of January and (generally) the first/second week of April.
How about instead of clumping them altogether, we get one every two months or so. That would be far better :)
My da hosts a Bible study group in their home, and recently I glanced at a booked they were going through called “The War on Christianity” or some shit like that. I just gave a short laugh and said “Oooooh, you poor oppressed Christians!” before my mother gave me “the look” that said “I know how you feel, but please don’t start shit right now.”
These people have no idea what oppression is. They think that people having negative opinions of Christianity is “oppression”. They think that folks fighting for abortion rights is “oppression” against Christians. They think that folks telling them that they gave no intention to get involved in their religion is “oppression”.
They are still allowed to gather freely, to hold positions of power, own homes and businesses, proselytize, protest, etc.
They’re just mad that they’re finally being called out for their harmful, hateful, and bigoted viewpoints. It’s “oppression” because they can’t force everyone else to follow their rules.
I was curious, so i googled. Was it The Global War on Christianity?
Christianity is illegal in parts of the world. I can understand why Christians in America would read a book about it
And in many parts of the world they are doing irreparable harm.
Plus, they only buy that book to feel sorry about themselves. US Christians have a persecution fetish.
It’s easy to see why they feel that way. Imagine an Affirmative Action style of law was passed to prioritize felons to get jobs. Non-felons (who have ALL the advantages) would suddenly find themselves occasionally losing a job a person who is different for genuinely wrong reasons. “I didn’t get the accounting job because someone who did time for 3 counts of Wire Fraud applied and got preferential treatment”. If that were me, I’d be pissed. In fact, I’d feel a little bit oppressed. I mean, same direction but hitting your later points. What if a law came out protecting people on the sexual predator registry against being discussed or discriminated against? I think you and I could agree to riot in the streets, no? Even though it be protecting a minority from the majority.
As wrong as their mindset is, they think Christianity is the one and only “right thing” wrt religion. So despite being the majority, if someone gets any protection from them for being “wrong”, they feel as oppressed as you might feel if you couldn’t stop a child predator across from the town’s elementary school… Now you and I know that there’s no foundation for Christians to say all other religions are wrong and theirs correct, but Christians who feel that way don’t.
Again, it might not help to understand why there’s some logic to their complaints, but it’s context and knowing our “enemy” can be valuable…
That’s not quite the same thing though because you’re talking about giving another group of people preferential treatment over everyone else.
But what things like abortion laws give people is the right to self-determination. No one saying that anyone who doesn’t want an abortion has to have an abortion they are just saying that it’s an allowable option.
In your example it’s like saying that exfelons have the right to have their record sealed once they’ve served their time. They’re not given preferential treatment they’re just equalized to everyone else.
That’s not quite the same thing though because you’re talking about giving another group of people preferential treatment over everyone else.
Obviously. I’m explaining how people with a flawed mindset think, not defending that mindset.
But what things like abortion laws give people is the right to self-determination
Also obviously true. There are some common-sense counterpoints (basically, anti-choice folks don’t act like abortion is murder, they pretend that it is, and that shows their lie), but if a person genuinely thought abortion was literally murder, it becomes an apple-to-apple comparison to their broken alt-right point of view; and importantly, it’s consistent. Consistent viewpoints are often harder to rebut than ones with obvious self-contradictions.
In your example it’s like saying that exfelons have the right to have their record sealed once they’ve served their time. They’re not given preferential treatment they’re just equalized to everyone else.
That’s why I didn’t use that example. I’m trying to show why certain twisted beliefs are consistent enough for millions of people to hold them. If my example were ex-felons (while it is a somewhat more appropriate comparison) it would not lead to an internally consistent viewpoint.
As I said to the other commentor, my explanation isn’t about trying to defend that user’s parents to him. It’s trying to help him understeand, a basis through which they can perhaps decide what to do next, or not do next.
I understand it just fine. And it’s still fucked up.
“It’s okay to bomb Palestinian civilians because the Jews are God’s chosen people and the land was given to them as their divine right” is unforgivable. Yet, it’s part of my da’s religious belief because “it says so in scripture.”
If you’re using religion to justify harm, direct or indirect, you’re a shit person who has no business telling others how to live their lives. And they can shut their fucking mouths if they try to tell me how they’re the real oppressed ones.
Comparing other religions to child abusers doesn’t quite seem the best way to make your argument.
Then you missed my argument. I’m trying to help the reader get an understanding to his family’s insanity, not say their insanity is correct. There is no knowledge that is not power. So knowing how the other side thinks is important.
Christmas is a European pagan tradition, really we base our holidays around seasons of which due to the importance of them also feature many religious events.
I hate that argument because the reason why it’s still celebrated isn’t the pagan origin but its appropriation by the Christian Church.
Except for like all the places still celebrating Yule, imbolc, halloween. If Christianity never genocided its way across Europe, we’d still be celebrating at these times with many of the same customs.
Plus if we let the Christian’s get away with stealing everything, we’d have nothing left.
But you’re right, we can do more to remove religion from government.
We don’t get holidays for Yuletide, Imbolc or Halloween in North America, but we get them for Christmas and Easter, connect the dots.
On the other hand its turned into a decedant festival of feasting and alcohol so the pagans kind of won on that one. Which is also the reason for celebrating it for all the non-christians that do.
By that logic, if you get enough people to party on a specific day, the government will make it a holiday, right?
Yes… GOD forbid.
The Muslim Christian comparison doesn’t really hold up, holy days they actually get off happen 2-3 times a year but Muslims have to pray five times a day every day. I would hope if a Christian or any other religion (or heck non religious students who need a mindfulness break) would be respected for a prayer break. Otherwise it would be unfair.
That said more holidays sounds great so by all means give us the Muslim ones off of school too 😎
Christians by the bible and old customs are also supposed to pray in the morning noon and evening. Thats why the churches ring the bell at those times.
So it is only by not taking their religion all too serious anymore that christians dont ask for their noon prayer.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here. I assume you’re referring to Psalm 55. Psalm 55:16-19 (NLT):
But I will call on God,
and the Lord will rescue me.
Morning, noon, and night
I cry out in my distress,
and the Lord hears my voice.
He ransoms me and keeps me safe
from the battle waged against me,
though many still oppose me.
God, who has ruled forever,
will hear me and humble them.
That’s not a mandate, it’s a description of how often David prayed. But there is a mandate in 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18:
Always be joyful. Never stop praying. Be thankful in all circumstances, for this is God’s will for you who belong to Christ Jesus.
God is always listening, and He doesn’t like it when prayers (as in people who pray) babble just to check boxes. The same almost certainly applies to scheduled prayers. If there’s a legitimate purpose, there’s nothing wrong with that, but praying just because it’s praying time doesn’t make sense. Especially since we’re supposed to keep the comms open all the time anyways.
Not sure how you are interpreting the Thessalonians verse, which EXPLICITLY says “never stop praying” as god doesn’t like it when people pray for no reason. Seems to me that, at least for this specific verse, this is exactly what god wants.
I know Catholics and Anglicans have liturgy of the hours, but based on what I learned in my studies they have never been mandatory save for priests and nuns! Contrasted with Islam where praying five times a day is one of the five pillars of the faith and salvation is seen as dependent on those.
You are missing the point.
Easter this year is the 31st of March.
The ENTIRE COUNTRY (the UK this is) will be forced to SHUT DOWN for the weekend, whether they are Christian or not. Banks. Businesses. Everything will close for the entire weekend.
But wait – it gets worse.
The school year is split into three terms – Winter, Spring and Summer. And because Easter is so early (because a bunny looked at a gopher’s shadow or something) the Spring term starts in January (with the New Year) and ends on the 24th of March (I think). That’s barely enough time to get kids settled in their classes. Then the summer term is like A BILLION WEEKS LONG because Easter is so early.
Then — when Easter is a lot later – you get the two bank holidays in May (one of which is religious, one of which isn’t) that fuck up the summer term and make it almost not worth going back for the one week before you are off again.
This is entirely because of Christian holy days
And on top of all this there is the fact we still keep “Sunday special” – a day that only one religion gives a crap about. Thankfully we are getting over that and starting to treat Sunday like every other day of the week. But if you ask most people they think it should still be “a rest day” because it is Sunday.
This entire country bends over backwards to accommodate Christianity in everything it does, and yet the Little Englanders always feel Christians are hard-done by.
Well like I said I have no issues with the holidays being changed! Either adding more or changing the dates so everyone can celebrate their own religious or non religious traditions on the same days. Agree with you about Sundays too, nobody should be forced to work that day but otherwise I don’t think it should be treated differently. I don’t think that changes the leaving class to pray points though.
It is not legally required for places to close for any of these holidays, and a large amount simply do not (whether it’s the majority or not I cannot say). I have worked in many places where I don’t get these days off.
On these holidays… most people go out and go places which need people working, so businesses choosing to close on these holidays is their own decision, which they should do in my opinion, it’s nice to know that you and everyone you know is off. I don’t really care why we’re having the holiday.
I’m pretty sure Sunday trading laws do actually require businesses to close early on a Sunday.
Yeah I’ve just looked it up;
any shop that is over the size of 3,000 sq ft (somewhat arbitrary size but there you go) may only open on a Sunday between the hours of 10:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m.
Attempts to remove this restriction have historically been politically blocked
The rest of the time they can do what they want which usually means 9:00 a.m. to 10:00 p.m. or just 24 hour
Most supermarkets will be 24-hour except on Sundays when they weirdly close at 4:00 p.m. - if they were legally allowed to be open longer I’m sure they would be.
This entire country bends over backwards to accommodate Christianity in everything it does, and yet the Little Englanders always feel Christians are hard-done by.
Might be one of those “you don’t respect me as an authority but I’m going to act as if you don’t respect me as a person” kinda things.
For daily prayers, yes that is a daily occurance. We pray 5 times a day but only the afternoon prayers are something we’d need to take a break for.
But you can work around it and you might only need to take a 5 minute break once a day. So like the post and you have mentioned it’s not that much of an interruption.
However, Fridays are a different story. We have to go our sermon which might be an hour so. In the US Saturday+Sundays are off so that’s not something that would interfere with a work/school schedule. Personally, in our high school we held our own prayers after school on Fridays. But I know for a fact that didn’t work for all my Muslim peers.
Holidays are another issue, we’d need to take 2 days off a year to observe our holidays. I wouldn’t go as far as so say this is systemic oppression. You just get an excused absence or use pto lol.
Where it would become a problem is if your requests to take off work/school were to be denied. But thankfully that isn’t usually an issue in the US.
Besides, in some school districts non-Christian holidays are starting to become recognized and may already be off.
Overall there is a consistent minor friction causes by daily schedule differences. And especially in school a student may never even ask for accommodations for fear of being “different”. Even though when you ask generally when you ask you will be accommodated.
