Can we get a consensus on whether our community should de-federate with servers that host loli? I personally think we should block them, and if that ends up not being the consensus here then I’ll probably sign up on another server. I hope we can all agree to set that boundary though because I like it here and it seems otherwise pretty cool.
To everyone saying just block the communities:
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I don’t want to have to block communities. In order to know I need to block a community, I have to see content which I feel is worth blocking. That’s fine for most cases but in this case that is not fine (to me personally).
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I don’t necessarily want to associate or interact with people who are fine having a server with loli as their home server. Not to be mean about it but that’s just how I feel flat out.
I think this is an instance where de-federation is the correct course of action.
I don’t want to have to block communities. In order to know I need to block a community,
so you’re puttin the onus on the admins? its the same process with different steps, just block the communities you dont want to see as they pop up. No need to search them out.
EDIT: spelling
I’d like a feature for user specific defederation of communities as you’ve mentioned. Not sure it is possible though.
If you defederate it does that also block me from seeing posts here since my instance has not defederated it?
Its a pretty strong stance to say I don’t want to interact with anyone who hasn’t defederated X.
I’m just checking out Lemmy for the first time so I’m not up to speed entirely on how everything works, but isn’t the point of the system that you chose where to create or move your account so you can choose a community that already blocks stuff? I personally chose one that had nothing blocked and was blocked by nothing to start and intend to move to somewhere else if I see the need.
Kind of. In an ideal world where all the instances have already been created so we know what communities have what content. The problem is that as more people migrate and create their own instances or communities there will inevitably be new ones that are automatically federated with shit that just goes over a line of decency. As things change over time, so will the instances and which other instances they’re federated with.
Absolutely block instances hosting illegal content - the way federation works means copies / caches of content can end up on this server? Or even if that’s not how lemmy does it, it risks using this server to facilitate the spread of something incredibly harmful & damaging.
As far as I’m concerned there’s no argument for allowing / normalising content produced which quite literally ruins peoples lives.
Edit: Even stuff that’s purely cartoonish in nature for me is just grim, and I don’t want to be a part of a community which supports it.
Edit2: If a server can block a specific community posting CSAM then maybe that’s a better solution than blocking the underlying infrastructure. If that’s not possible, I think defederation is the only real way to deal it, as frustrating as that would be for legitimate users.
Its literally not illegal in 90% of countrys because its just drawings. And if you don’t like it block it for yourself. This mindset leads to massive over-blocking.
In general I’d agree and say yeah, let people decide for themselves but content like this, which normalises or legitimises real world harms, shouldn’t be something easily stumbled upon.
Viewing that sort of content, or building community around its enjoyment, isn’t going to lead anywhere good.
Allowing it to show up here is net-negative.
It’s been a long time since I’ve looked, but studies suggest that porn in general doesn’t have a major effect on your behavior. It might lead to insecurity, but it doesn’t lead to action. Some people are worried about legality, most people just don’t want to see it, those are fine and dandy but anything else is just moral outrage
That’s not how it works. Instances don’t cache images from other instances. If you hover your mouse over an image you can clearly see the site it’s hosted on is in fact not originating from the instance you’re browsing on. It works like Pleroma, Akkoma, Rebased, and other Pleroma forks.
IANAL, but I believe you can’t be held liable for hosting links to other images on a site, regardless if they’re embedded through the website’s UI. They’re not stored there, afterall. The client is rendering them.
All that gets cached, I believe, is the text and users from remote instances. And by cached, I mean stored in the postgres DB.
I’d like that shit gone too. I understand not wanting to close ourselves off too much but I think things like avoiding groups that are ok with shit like loli is a no brainer.
Please do not. Although I don’t personally want to see lolicon stuff, many of the servers willing to host it have communities I want to interact with. For instance, burggit.moe is where the touhou communities went and is otherwise a pretty nice instance aside from loli communities.
It is content which, while understandably offensive to some, harms nobody. All fictional porn, no matter how deviant it is, is ultimately more ethical than real porn can be.
It should be up to users to block or hide instances with content they don’t wish to see, and defederation should be reserved for communities that consistently cause interference, not for communities that simply have content which one disagrees with.
As I’ve pointed out in a few spots on this post: regardless of your moral stance, loli is considered the same as child porn by many government agencies. You may not be “harming” anyone, but you’re harming the people that host and view that content in a criminal sense.
why are all of the touhou communites on there
like, that’s weird; there’s tons of lemmy instances that they could have been on, and kbin has a (very inactive) community as well
onto the point:
All fictional porn, no matter how deviant it is, is ultimately more ethical than real porn can be.
This may be true, but you can’t blame many users for being really turned off by it; like I think it’d be perfectly acceptable if most people don’t want to interact with an instance hosting that.
If you don’t like that, then you might have to move to another instance tbh
Loli stuff is illegal though, at least in the United States. Viewing even accidentally can be considered a crime. The OP has a valid point.
I’m not a lawyer either, but a quick search shows that state law is the thing this could be breaking. It’s not criminally punishable to possess it, but acquiring or distributing it via the internet is potentially illegal. Here’s a page from a Massachusetts lawyer discussing the legality. https://anthonyricciolaw.com/is-lolicon-legal-in-the-us/#:~:text=Under federal law%2C a simple,state laws regarding child pornography.
Edit: apparently that’s only part of the requirements for illegality. The other part is sexuality or not having “value” which is subjective. Either way, it’s a dice roll on criminal acts.
I’ve seen this image where it’s basically a state by state case of legality
It should be up to instance admins to decide, since they are ultimately responsible for the things that are hosted/accessible on their server.
I for one would not want to be effectively distributing any porn or loli stuff on my server, so I’ll be defederating from instances that are entirely that.
