Tesla’s value plunged nearly $200 billion since mid-July – and the EV maker faces a bumpy road ahead::Tesla shares closed Tuesday at just over $233, well down on their 2023 peak of $291.
maybe they should focus on making a decent product
Well Musk is spending most of his time breaking Xitter lately so maybe the Tesla guys can get some good stuff done while he’s distracted.
Probably not. Tesla is very dysfunctional as an org. He flattened it so much, and hasn’t appointed a real leader, while he’s distracted I bet they’re basically in a holding pattern.
He motivated them by setting insane goals then driving them insanely hard and sleeping in the office and shit.
If he’s not doing that, the company is, pardon the pun, on autopilot. Watch out for stopped emergency vehicles.
he’s been at it for a while, and Tesla hasn’t improved any, so don’t know…
The products are decent. Just that there are a lot more competitions that make much better cars.
I wouldn’t call a $40,000 car whose panels fly off on the highway, decent
What if that car can drive you straight into a wall with the power of AI?
over the course of 30 years*. people rarely keep cars for that long, let alone an EV. by year 10 most EVs will be clapped as fuck you might just have to sell it for scrap metal
fact is Teslas still represent good value if you’re just after a base Model Y and 3. they’re are OK, average, decent.
fit and finish is far from German counterparts but if you don’t care, and don’t want a Chinese EV either you’re left with Tesla.
A friend of mine rented a 2023 Tesla recently. He said there was a visible air gap between the trunk lid and the body of the car. That’s decent to you?
lol, do you mean panel gaps? that has more to do with manufacturing process. I’m more referring to the features they provide for the price they’re selling at. They’re decent.
I can assure you, cars can get a lot less decent than Teslas… Korean cars in the early 2000s for example…
Setting aside anything related to Musk, Tesla really doesn’t seem to be staying competitive.
Cybertruck (and the “indestructible” window press conference) is probably the easiest example. Years of attempted hype that haven’t paid off in a meaningful manner, while rivals have been releasing in-class competition. Anyone can see that’s a problem.
Tesla cars used to be pretty revolutionary, now they’re in an entirely different era that’s filling with exciting EV alternatives around every corner. Yet Tesla style still looks the same. The shoddy construction is still around and becoming more widespread knowledge. They’re failing to attract their target audience due to a long series of missteps. More problems.
Not to mention that Tesla was downright overpriced at its height. It’s a fraction of the volume yet made other automaker valuations look minuscule. The logic for that was never there.
Besides Musk…it’s the fact they are still using the same design from 10+ years ago. When I see a tesla, I can’t tell the difference between the S & 3 or the X & Y. They made one car and scaled it in their software. All 4 cars are due for a redesign and they don’t need to all look identical. And they need to figure out how to actually assemble them without being shit.
Model S3xy? Why Elon, just why…
The model X looks like an inflated model 3 IMO, the first time I saw one IRL it looked kinda hideous
I’m not a car guy. There happened to be a tesla showroom at the mall (wtf?) I was at with some coworkers for lunch, and one of them was dying to look at the new model X, so we made a detour. It was the first tesla I sat in.
I couldn’t believe how cheap and tacky it felt. Everything was plasticy, leather felt like pleather. The giant tablet just seemed unnecessary and gaudy.
The tech was cool and all, but I couldn’t believe this was what everyone was talking about.
Nothing wrong with that if it’s successful. VW used the same design language for the Beetle/Van/Truck for ages.
Same design language and copy cats are different. I can clearly make the difference of a Jetta/Passat or Civic/Accord. They obviously share a similar design but are definitely their own. Tesla’s on the other hand, I couldn’t tell you the difference of the X or Y. They look identical. Even the sedans look damn near identical. And no other car company keeps the exact same design for 10+ years (besides Toyota and the 4Runner)
Exactly people say this but then not about Mazda. Every single Mazda has the same design scheme. There’s nothing wrong with that, if it works for the company fine, but like, “oh they all look the same” is invalid as a complaint against them.
Tesla has many other things you can diss on them for.
Cybertruck is a symptom of poor leadership. Maybe after it flops, Tesla will clean house.
While I agree Cybertruck may have jumped the shark, I recently noticed …. After years of GM saying cylindrical batteries are not practical and pouch batteries are the only way to go, and Ultium is more advanced than anything Tesla has …. They’re redesigning EV models early to switch to cylindrical batteries like Tesla
The only reason GM (and others) tried to tout pouch cells is because there was a complete lack of cylindrical production capacity available. Tesla was using it all.
What are you going to do, say we’d rather use these other batteries but we can’t, so here you go?
I am ecstatic that most of the major manufactures have finally decided to transition to prismatic and/or cylindrical.
I wouldn’t even be surprised if regulations one day prevent use of pouch cells for automotive purposes.
Give it 5 - 10 years. Tesla will be a company that makes and maintains a charging station network and sells batteries to the other auto makers.
It’s becoming increasingly obvious that they can’t hack it in an automotive sales industry. Which is fine, frankly. I think battery manufacturing and charging network are pretty complimentary industries and provide a decent revenue stream into the future, License the charging tech to other automakers early and get some vendor lock-in going, and the company could be in it for the long haul.
They might even be able to keep making a couple EVs, to prove new charging or battery tech, much like how Google keeps making Pixel phones to essentially prove and market new Android features.
and sells batteries to the other auto makers.
My limited understanding of the matter is that their batteries are overpriced and nothing special compared to alternatives.
The real game changer that seems to be coming down the pipeline is the solid state battery Toyota has been teasing. If they manage to bring that to market while holding important patents on the technology it’s basically game over for other kinds of battery for EVs.
Are you referring to Tesla’s 4680’s or the cells that Tesla gets from Pansonic?
Re: Panasonic
Tesla’s been refining their cells with Panasonic for quite awhile and have done things like substantially reduced the cobalt used compared to others (at least as of couple years ago). I’m not sure what the differences in wh/kg are compared to others today.
Panasonic is also much more efficient at making those cells at scale which gives Tesla an edge on their cost.
Tesla has always made their own batteries (the grouping of the cells). Their battery + BMS on the other hand is substantially better than other manufacturers. They can manufacture the battery much cheaper than others, and the BMS keeps it running smoothly.
For example - The Fords Mach E performance model can’t (or couldn’t) even do more than a launch or two before having to throttle itself due to heat. They currently have recalls happening due to contactors having problems with heat.
Re: Tesla’s 4680 Cells
Right now, they’re nothing special from a wh/kg perspective, what they’re main goal for them is to be substantially cheaper to manufacture than the cells other manufactures make. If you can make them for 2/3 the cost you’ll have huge advantage over everyone else, and then also you don’t have to pay the mark up to Panasonic or LG either.
Only time will tell if their chemistry/anode/cathode improvements will make their cells better than what other manufactures are producing now and in the future. Personally, I’d be nervous to get a 1st / 2nd gen version of these cells/batteries while they work things out.
Re: Solid state
If that ever happens and they are cost competitive to produce, then that’ll be a big deal ya. What if they aren’t cost competitive though?
Will you be willing to pay $10-15k more for the same range but faster charging, higher safety, and more lifecycles?
You’re right though, they are the future eventually.
Have they even released that damn truck? It’s been years and I haven’t seen one while the s,3,x, and Ys are everywhere when I go to work
Nope. First production one completed in July, nearly four years after the first press release. Supposedly customer deliveries at some point of Q3 2023, which is basically down to a month left.
The first truck was also “completed” right before their quarterly earnings, which I’m sure was a coincidence. No other trucks have been publicly shown to be assembled.
They have a massive head start, but that will not last.
BYD is not far behind them and VW is closing fast. 2022 EV volumes
Not Tesla, FSD requires hands on at all times while stuff like Supercruise does not.
Supercruise doesn’t work on local roads, drive assist does. I can keep my pinky on the wheel and give it the slightest pressure every few minutes when prompted. This is a God send in stop and go city traffic. I used to have super high stress in traffic every day, now I let the Tesla do all the stop and go braking/keeping distance and it’s way less stressful
Mercedes for example has two cars that just launched FSD this year. Vs Tesla who has 4 cars that can do autopilot for 3 years or more. Again I’m not trying to say Tesla is the best car, I’m trying to say they have differntiated features that few, if not any companies have had over the years, and yea that does not excuse their CEO from being a total douche.
Exactly. So many of the naysayers haven’t used fsd first hand, so they don’t know how close they are to solving a huge problem. And no one else is really even trying anymore. Ask a graduating senior in IT or robotics where they dream of working and it’s Tesla.
If you’re using FSD without your hands, you’re not doing what you’re explicitly supposed to be doing.
So basically you’re saying that so many of the naysayers haven’t used FSD the wrong (and dangerous) way.
Such a remarkably overvalued company. I’d be surprised if it’s still around in a few decades. Feels like they’re the MySpace of today - they’re big and have first mover advantage but have nothing interesting down the line and newer companies will and are supplanting it.
Elon’s business model was not to be in the car business long term but the your-car-is-also-a-taxi business and reaping the profits of not just selling cars but ride-sharing too. Triple dipping if you count the supercharger stations, basically collecting a fee every time you use your car. I can see the bull run when things are framed from the perspective of magical Christmasland, but there’s a slightly larger than zero but still basically zero percent chance that FSD on Teslas will ever work autonomously and their cars are getting smoked domestically because they have competition now where they didn’t before.
They’re building a new plant in Mexico.
That’s what will really take the comparative stock price of actual automakers into the stratosphere with Tesla you guys, a fucking factory in Mexico. How could Ford or Hyundai match having a factory in Mexico?!
Lol, the last Ford I bought (shit car btw) was built in Mexico. Tell me again why Tesla has 20x the market cap of Ford because it surely ain’t factories in Mexico.
Jeez I can understand not liking a billionaire and their product, but are you okay?
Why do you ask that? Whenever Musk gets mentioned (or any billionaire for that matter) similar words immediately spring to mind. Most people I know also feel this way too. Are YOU ok for not feeling this way?
I guess I’m just out of the loop. The most I know about musk is his ridiculous Twitter changes, naming his child aex12 or some crap like that, and shady EV range stuff. Can definitely see why people are saying he’s scum, but why is he being called a Nazi?
Good, the MAGA car company should lose value.
this is a dumb comment. most maga dicks would never drive an EV they’re too busy rolling coal. yes the spokesperson for Tesla is a piece of human garbage, but the company is more than him. Tesla has been hugely responsible for the much needed transition to EVs. So hate musk, but i think hating Tesla is a mistake.
I can hate tesla too you know. The car is terrible quality. Just because it is an EV doesn’t excuse it from being shitty
A lot of the problem with Tesla is Musk though, especially when it comes to the whole FSD and Autopilot thing. Tesla is spreading misleading data and releasing software to the public that they really shouldn’t be, and it’s Musk that is pushing for that to happen.
True, musk sucks. like I said. the downvotes are hilarious. guess a lot of the maga trolls followed here from reddit too. the more popular it gets the worse it will become I expect.
This is a very reasonable comment, and yet it’s downvoted heavily.
What Tesla achieved is good, and will have a place in the history of EVs. Musk being a fucking idiot doesn’t change that, it just makes it more obvious that none of the success is due to him he just happens to own the company.
Honestly, tesla would probably do better to fucking fire Musk as CEO. He holds less than 13% of the shares according to a 10-second Google search, so it doesn’t seem like he has unassailable control of the company.
If I were any of the other large shareholders I’d be fighting like hell to get a better CEO. Musk has switched from asset to liability.
thank you for restoring my faith in humans. I really didn’t understand the downvotes tbh.
