I was right in the edge of Gen Z and Millennial and grew up being the family’s tech kid. It still astounds me now that my younger sisters don’t know how to even look for solutions. They just get me. Having moved out I get texts and calls sometimes. I’ve had to explain that using a computer is a skill that is learnable. I didn’t learn by going to someone else. I had to learn how to learn. That’s the skill we should be teaching kids. Not how to solve the problems, but how to FIND the solution to problems.
As someone also near the border between Gen Z and Millennial, I relate a lot to this comment. I was also the family tech kid, and since like middle school I’ve always told people “I’m not good with computers, I just know how to use a search engine”
My “computer literacy” is literally just basic research skills; knowing how to formulate a web search and how to identify bad sources.
Right! This is why I say it has more to do with being stubborn than being smart. If you’re determined to find a solution and you’re half decent at research and following instructions, you can figure a lot out, but people treat it like you invented the thing with some magical knowledge that they could never possess.
You’ve just articulated a feeling I’ve had most of my life, but couldn’t have described better.
Solving trivial problems for people they could easily do themselves if they just muddled through the work of it. Then act like I’m a genius, when it’s really just ‘stubbornness’ and refusing to admit i can’t figure it out.
Thanks for that.
It’s the issue that is the most baffling to me. Learning how to search properly can be done in 10 minutes but no one does it.
If I want a recipe for a burger with onions, I’ll search for “recipe burger with onions.” When people around me search for the same recipe, they would type “I’m hungry and I’d like stuff with onions and shit” and instead of getting one of the billion web sites with recipes, they would stumble upon a weird blog about an anorexic girl who is obsessed with onions, and think that the internet contain no recipes at all.
I think we can blame the education system. At some point it became solely about passing some arbitrary threshold of students with high exam scores rather than about teaching students how to get by in life.
End result was an education system that simply teaches kids how to pass exams rather than basic life skills like critical thinking.
I also blame the education system, the fact that my computer teacher thought that opening R, trying to reconnect to WiFi, and opening the cmd prompt were all attempts at “hacking” is sad. The fact our robotics class shut down when the exchange student left, because he was the only who knew how to program was sadder.
Part of the problem is the people making the standards don’t even know how ignorant they are themselves. Like I at least recognize I have a lot learning to go, and lean heavily on people more experienced than me in fields I’m not the expert.
The late 90s Gen Z/Millennial DMZ is a painful place to exist. Constant and mandatory tech support.
The ones that is blamed for the ills of society by both the baby boomers and younger gen zs
Yep. I was born 1998. To Millennials, I’m a tiny baby Gen Z, to Gen Zs, I may as well be a boomer. It’s odd.
Growing up poor confuses things even more, because I have more in common with people born late 80s/early 90s than with people born only a few years after me. My first game console was a SNES and we had a VCR until we got a PS2, and kept using it well after.
I’m also between gen Z and millennial and was the family’s tech kid and still get calls. Are you me? :D
Just yesterday I got a call asking how to select all images in a directory… And then another call about how to get those images to Google Drive, which is literally just drag and drop… And one of the people involved was my gen Z younger sister.
the family’s tech kid and still get calls
I don’t know how you all get calls. I have literally never been called to fix a computer. People prefer to pay some random guy at Walmart who will scam them, instead of calling me and getting free help. And I’m not a troll, not an asshole, or an incel, I’m a regular guy, I’m friendly, but people don’t seem to care, they prefer paying for useless help.
Teach a child to fish, basically.
If we keep making it easy for them… Ask and I’ll give you all the answers… They’ll never learn.
My first response these days is, “What have you tried so far?” And, “What are you searching for in ‘Google’?”
I also ask “what have you tried so far” mostly because too many times I get into troubleshooting and then discover that they’ve created a new problem while doing their own troubleshooting. (Like one time they plugged in a second cable between two switches - good god was that hard to troubleshoot remotely)
I’m going to go a bit further and say that kids today are not worse than in the past. It’s been 20 years since I taught computers but the doom and gloom here could have easily been posted in 2002 with only minor rewording.
GUIs got good with the launch of the Mac in 1984, and by the launch of XP & Mac OS X in ‘01 good GUIs were cheap. This brought computers into way more homes and exposed them both to kids who liked them for their own sake and to kids who saw them primarily as a tool.
I think people like this handwringing about kids not understanding computers on a deep enough level for their taste are just being obtuse.
I write software now instead of teaching and I write the kind of software that people should be able to just use as a tool.
We’ve had 20 years where the vast majority of computer users understand latin better than they understand their computers. It’s fine. It’ll continue to be fine.
Man, I didn’t realize that article was written in 2013, it could’ve been written today, and it still would’ve been true. I think one of the biggest contributions to the tech illiteracy of people is, 1. Schools don’t really teach you about that kind of stuff (in my experience, or unless you take a special course) and 2. Everything is basically done for you now, its incredibly easy to do anything basic on computers.
So when the author says it’s the 30-50 year olds that know how to use computers, today it’s the 40-60 year olds. I’d say it goes older than that.
One thing that used to bug me on reddit was youngsters going on about how over-50s wouldn’t know how to use a computer. That hasn’t been the case for decades now.
It’s actually the 8-80 year olds that don’t know how to use computers.
Most people don’t know. They just know how to use a handful of programs. But the vast majority of them don’t understand the basic concepts behind them. Things like files and directories are nebulous at best.
Does it matter? A little, because so much stuff revolves around computers nowadays. Which means that they don’t really understand the world they’re navigating daily. OTOH, they live perfectly well as they are, so it clearly doesn’t matter to them.
We’re going to end up like that society in Star Trek that worships a computer.
Hear hear! We 40-50+ year old geeks were learning the Internet as it rolled out. Before that we were upgrading our PCs and modems as funds permitted, joining & running BBS’s on DOS. OS/2 seemed futuristic and I ran it for a while, but Linux won my heart. As a teenager, I had my favourite kernel hackers, tested their patches, chatted with them on IRC. Before that, we had our C64s, Amiga 500s and similar. We had the greatest opportunity to learn, and we loved it.
Over the last 10 years I’ve really had to dumb down my interview questions, covering a wider range of topics until I (hopefully) find a spark of passion and beyond-user-level knowledge about anything (even unrelated to the position)… it used to be easier.
I still remember getting in trouble at my public school with the IT admin because my friends and I discovered how to write BAT files, and had the brilliant idea to create a bunch of fork bombs that self-replicated until they froze their host computer.
Unfortunately I think kids today don’t even get enough leeway to figure that sort of shit out. But kids are awfully good at finding cracks in systems, so maybe they’ve just figured out how to get up to similar hijinks with GUIs and cloud storage.
I was showing an intern how to install a software the intern needed. The computer setup was a laptop with two external monitors. After we installed the software from one of the external monitors, the intern asked “so will this install the software in the other screen?” I was flabbergasted.
I’m pushing 50 and when people ask me how I know so much about computers, my first comment is that I had to program my first computer for it to do anything.
My second is that I actively sought to learn, and you can too.
Later in life Linux played a huge role in understanding how these contraptions work. Ironically, I’m a human factors engineer, so I’m also guilty of creating part of the problem. User interfaces that “just work”… Until they don’t.
I had to program my first computer for it to do anything.
Sadly, most people have no grasp what that even means. I’ve had adults think that means I “downloaded something into the computer” and then it worked.
It was around that time I just stopped talking to anyone outside of my geek circle about anything technical. Best to play dumb.
Yeah, I realized I started to sound snarky when I said “I work on computers” when people ask me what I do. Didn’t mean it to sound dumb, it was just honestly the level of understanding about computers a lot strangers had when they asked.
Saying I did networking or worked with servers didn’t mean much, but sometimes people would ask me to work on their WiFi…