By that argument, the American revolution shouldn’t have happened either. It’s patently absurd to claim all revolutions always lead to the same results.
Removing a foreign occupier through violent revolution actually has a pretty good track record, yes (markedly different from destroying an unjust domestic system through violent revolution.)
Which one are you advocating for within the meme? Or something else? “Must be destroyed” can mean a few different things, all the way from FDR or Bernie Sanders which I’d be in favor of all the way to Russian Revolution which I’m not. I’m sort of just taking a guess at what it might be and responding based on the guess, but yeah I’m open to hear more explanation.
Removing a foreign occupier through violent revolution actually has a pretty good track record, yes (markedly different from destroying an unjust domestic system through violent revolution.)
You realize that Britain was not a “foreign occupier” at that point, yes? Likewise, most liberal democracies you have now are results of revolutions against the monarchies. Exactly how do you think the world changed from monarchic feudalism to capitalist democracy? Magic? The Kings abdicated because they were all just nice people?
Which one are you advocating for within the meme?
You’re in an anarchist server talking to an anarchist. Take a wild guess :D
Britain was not a foreign occupier in 1700s colonial America? Must be news to the Algonquian, Iroquois, and Wampanoag.
You realize that Britain was not a “foreign occupier” at that point, yes?
My point is that the system of having people physically on one side of the ocean making decisions for the people on the other side, with no pretense of it being fair or justified or representation for people from the New World, makes violent overthrow a lot more unavoidable. I think it’s more sensible to apply lessons from the American Revolution to the Mexican War of Independence than to what will happen if you walk into Washington DC armed, with a million of your friends, and announce that the system is going to be different now.
Likewise, most liberal democracies you have now are results of revolutions against the monarchies. Exactly how do you think the world changed from monarchic feudalism to capitalist democracy? Magic?
There are different responses appropriate to different levels of oppression. Violent overthrow of a monarchy is often the only way. Violent overthrow of a foreign occupation is often the only way. My point is that looking at the current system in the US, there are a lot of ways to “destroy” the system that will do a lot of damage to its positive aspects and not change much at all about its horrible aspects except for making them worse.
You’re in an anarchist server talking to an anarchist. Take a wild guess :D
Of course, it’s easy and surface-persuasive to say “destroy the system and things will be better” and keep the rest of it vague. Once you start getting into details is where you run into the oh shit it’s actually not that simple factor.
Who knows; for all I know, once I hear your details I will be on board for them. But it’s hard to say if it’s all vague and feely-good-based.
The American Revolution didn’t destroy the existing system, it replaced the British control of the colonies with a federal control of the States, each of the colonial governments had a fairly smooth transition to state government, using the existing structure and most of the same people.
Please don’t take this as anything other than a legitimate inquiry, as that’s how i intend it.
If we’re claiming that all of this bad is by design, and the point of the revolution was to create this system, then aren’t you saying that the revolution was wrong? Like, the founders intended to replace a monarchical people moving machine that killed some of the people and replaced it with a democratic one that kills some of the people. If they designed it that way, then the revolution was pointless, and if they didn’t design it that way, then the argument that the suffering is a feature (instead of a consequence) is demonstrably wrong…what am I missing?
