What is this supposed to tell us? Hamas used these as bases. Why shouldn’t they (both)?
Don’t get me wrong, fuck Netanyahu but Hamas has a well established history of using human shields, schools most definitely included:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_human_shields_by_Hamas
To claim otherwise simply isn’t true.
Israel has a well established record of using human shields. There have been countless cases. Video evidence, etc. Much more than an extremely biased wikipedia link.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_shields_in_the_Israeli–Palestinian_conflict
- https://truthout.org/articles/israel-systematically-uses-gaza-children-as-human-shields-rights-group-finds/
- https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-07-01/ty-article/report-israeli-soldiers-filmed-using-detainees-in-gaza-as-human-shields/00000190-6f2b-d6fc-afba-ef7b8ad20000
That’s not true, but let’s assume it is. What’s the acceptable child to terrorist death ratio?
It most certainly is true: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_human_shields_by_Hamas
Doesn’t excuse the Israeli administration, but Hamas 100% uses human shields, schools included.
Israel also uses human shields.
But even if hamas did, that doesn’t mean it is the case here. Just like how it wasn’t the case when they said there is a military base under a hospital, only to find a single tunnel used to smuggle in medicine after they completely bombed it down, including its residents.
Gaza is one of the most densely populated areas on the planet…
There’s no where anyone can be that doesn’t have a shit ton of civilians around, and due to the treatment of people who live in Gaza by Israel… A lot of people in Gaza are children.
That’s the whole reason the international community has been saying for almost a year you can’t just flatten everything.
But they keep doing it. Because Israel sees civilian deaths in Gaza as a feature, not a bug.
The question they asked is in presumption for this to be true.
Your non-answer speaks volumes.
What is the acceptable child to terrorist death ratio?
If you don’t know, the rational answer is 0 for the same reason why we dont let suspected pedophiles adopt children as a sacrifice to catch a bigger pedo ring.
The human shield lie is dead. The majority of structures in Gaza have been bombed and rendered uninhabitable. Israel is just destroying everything indiscriminately and killing anything that moves outside the designated camps.
Was Hamas using over half of all structures in Gaza as operating bases? Get real.
It’s already known that Hamas uses tunnels, why would they even be in the buildings at this point? This is just a campaign of total destruction.
Don’t spread genocide denial.
The wiki says they are accused of it but lists many reports which found no evidence of this. In the current conflict there are apparently a couple of cases with hostages.
The big problem with most of these claims is that it’s “proximate” shielding being alleged, which is not when you are literally shielding someone (as in the recent cases with Israel using Palestinians, and assumedly those with Hamas using the hostages), but when you are just sat at home, in school, whatever, going about your usual business totally unaware. But you are a “shield” because the enemy decides they want to attack something near you.
This quote really sums up the rhetorical strategy:
“Israeli citizens in Tel Aviv are not classified as shields when Hamas launches rockets towards the Israel Defense Forces military command headquarters located in the city center. By sharp contrast, Palestinian civilians are cast as human shields when Israel bombs Hamas command centers and military infrastructures in Gaza. In other words, if Hamas kills Israeli civilians, it is to blame, and if Israel kills Palestinian civilians, then Hamas is also to blame, since, at least ostensibly, it is Hamas that has deployed these civilians as shields.”
It is a trick so that Israel can avoid responsibility for it’s actions. I’m not saying you are supporting Israel or denying their crimes (I know you explicitly didn’t), but this rhetoric is WAY more common than genuine instances of human shielding, which thus far has primarily been done by Israel, not Hamas.
Likewise, this isn’t excusing Hamas. Fuck them. But aside from the case with the hostages (didn’t check the reference but I trust it), there is very little evidence that Hamas does this. Most of the time it is an outright deception.
Edit: this is from the report cited by wikipedia:
A witness said that as Israeli forces advanced, the fighters phoned the Israeli police using one of the hostages as an interpreter, identified themselves as from the Qassam Brigades, and told the police that they would shoot those they held if the Israeli forces fired on them. During the standoff, the attackers forced about half the hostages into the yard of the home between Israeli forces and the fighters, according to two witnesses the New York Times interviewed. A man the attackers said was their commander took off his clothing and took Yasmin Porat, one of the hostages, outside to shield him as he surrendered to the Israelis. After the fighters fired again at the Israeli forces, an Israeli tank opened fire on the home. The fighters were killed, as well as 12 hostages who were killed in the crossfire.
So clearly it does happen. But cases are rare and on both sides of the conflict
I will need to see concrete evidence that these people were, in fact, members of the terrorist resistance before I believe claims that they were. However, we are currently assuming that all claims of terrorists being present are true for every strike. I would like you to know that I selected these strikes at random.
- This claim states that there were 19 terrorists and 93 total killed at the Al-Tabi’in mosque and school on 08/10/24. Survivors state that most of the casualties were women and children. That means there was a 79.6% civilian casualty rate.
- This claim states that there were 9 confirmed Hamas casualties of 40 killed at a school in the Nuseirat refugee camp on 06/06/24. The casualties were described as children and elderly, and this strike was verified by the source as using US munitions. That means there was a 77.5% civilian casualty rate.
- This source claims that there have been (as of 07/06/24) 343 IDF soldiers killed and 38,000 confirmed Palestinian deaths with Israel claiming 1/3 of deaths are combatants. 66% civilian casualty rate since October 7th.
I will ask again: what is the acceptable child to terrorist death ratio?
Cool wikipedia article. But you should check out current reality sometime.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_shields_in_the_Israeli–Palestinian_conflict
- https://truthout.org/articles/israel-systematically-uses-gaza-children-as-human-shields-rights-group-finds/
- https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-07-01/ty-article/report-israeli-soldiers-filmed-using-detainees-in-gaza-as-human-shields/00000190-6f2b-d6fc-afba-ef7b8ad20000
Lmao just fucking say you support genocide, do you have any idea how ridiculous you look parroting Israeli lies that have been debunked a thousand times over?
Like, we know what you’re doing. It’s really fucking obvious.
Debunked what? That Hamas stores weapons in schools? Or shoots rockets from there? Sure sure, all fake videos to discredit the humanitarian Hamas that would never do such a thing. Hamas also does not have any incentive to cause as many civilian casualties as possible. They care so much about their people, they even make videos promoting how they rip out water pipes to make rockets , because obviously shooting rockets at you sworn enemy is more important than having water for your people.
Every single innocent person getting killed on both sides is a massive tragedy. But just letting Hamas be is obviously not an option anymore. They need to be removed, just like Nazis in WW2.
Israel doesn’t seem to give a shit about innocent people so don’t give this shitty IDF PR line about what a tragedy innocent deaths are. 40k dead that are counted in the hospitals that aren’t running anymore. Probably at least 100k more beneath the rubble. Just because Bibi doesn’t want to face the end of the war and his downfall. Maybe he can incite a new war with Hezbollah or Iran before Gaza is a wasteland, so he has more time. My government will surely support that as well. Just awesome shit man.
And there is a huge gap between letting Hamas be and bombing the living shit out of a school full of refugees with some Hamas members in them. Maybe it’s just that my and most people’s standards of not regarding Palestinian civilians as worth nothing are too high for the Israeli government.
People who post things like this, especially Linkerbaan, have to believe that the public has access to all of the information Israel and others have about where Hamas is at any given time. Some of the responses here seem to indicate that as well.
I simply don’t believe that’s the case. Imagine thinking that information which is probably secret or top secret (or whatever labeling system Israel uses) that Israel is using to make decisions is probably just online for them to review.
Aha, but the precision strike was on the small first floor window on the north side of the block. The school was evidently on the east side of the block, many many centimetres away. Please ignore surrounding blocks completely destroyed by bombs.
My mistake! Then that must have been the classroom with the terrorist inside.
There was a pipe going from the window all the way down to the Hama’s Tunnel under it with the terrorists.
The fighter jet of the brave Zionist tresistance just thread its way at low level between the rocket launchers of the evil Palestinians and hit that small hole causing the destruction of the entire evil outpost.
As far as I understand Israel doesn’t claim that it didn’t bomb a school area, it claims that it was filled with terrorists and had to go.
If I’m understanding this right, Israel is saying “this is the price that Gaza pays because we have to kill the terrorists” while also trying to minimize to the press how many civilians were actually caught up in these bombings.
Basically killing Hamas is above any Palestinian human rights for Israel, though I suspect that if the world wasn’t watching, the genocidal government there would actually just straight up give orders to kill them all.
No need to suspect. They’ve said many times that global opinion is the only thing curbing their genocide.
Just yesterday I was playing the Batman telltale series. In it, Mayor Dent, during his descent into becoming Two Face, blows up a city block in Gotham in an attempt to thwart a terrorist organization. Two Face was put in a mental asylum for the action. I vote we do the same thing to Netanyahu.
Haven’t the schools been closed for several months now? There shouldn’t be any civilians in there, let alone kids.
i’m not sure the israeli government thinks there are civilians in palestine
They have it in writing (leaked months ago) that some ridiculous number like over 1000 Palestinian civilian casualties were acceptable if they got to kill a terrorist.
Also, anyone in colors or in proximity to Hamas members or known gathering areas in the last 2 years, is automatically labeled a terrorist by Israel
Basically they pretend to have a formula to regulate civilian casualties but they have twisted its variables so far that any scenario can be solved by bombing no matter the collateral damage
Imagine responding to a genocide by crying about trump making a phone call. Post history is pathetic. Complete scum.
isn’t trump literally trying to call off a ceasefire though?
It sure seems to me like the collective mission of the israel/palestine people here in the US is just bitching about shit.
Aside from decrying war, which like, that’s a thing you can do. You have the right to do that, i don’t see them doing anything else.
I haven’t even heard of a ceasefire. Trump is just trying to get Israeli support since even American fascists are on to his nonsense.
They forgot to thank Biden, Harris and The USA for the thousands of bombs they have provided for Israel’s genocide. and the coming 20 Billion more of military support.
Listen, this might have looked like a school, but I assure you everyone inside that they killed was an October 7th terrorist.
They had thousands of miles of tunnels under there, with a million rockets ready to be fired. All supplied by Iran.
These school bombings were in self defense. And if you think otherwise, you’re Antisemitic
The tens of thousands innocents, mostly children, that Israel has slaughtered have been semites. So I’m not even gonna call you an anti-semite. You’re just a heartless prick.
do we even know how complicit biden and harris are for this shit? They’re just the administration, it’s the congress pushing the funding bill, and the bill passed, i feel like we should probably be focusing on the 500-600 odd members of congress that are seemingly fine with this instead of two people who are quite literally just sitting at the top of the chain.
there’s a lot that biden could have done ages ago. as things looked back when it first became obvious (at least to me,); if Biden had vetoed the aid package, that likely would have signaled a seachange in the dems and made the package not-super-majority proof.
But the first big one, they did lump it in with Ukraine and Taiwan specifically to get that stuff through republicans. Biden could have at any time vetoed the spending bills.
he could also have admited that they’re doing a genocide- or at the very least fucking warcrimes and be like “we need to hold onto that while you sort yourself out.”
The thing that pisses me of the most is that Biden is getting his zionist smeared across Harris- but I think she could actually be persuadable- but not if everyone is being assholes about it. She’s just not presently in a position to set policy. I hope I’m not reading it wrong and that her silence right now is… to not upset whatever the fuck Biden actually is doing. Because. as idioticly pathetically impotent as Biden is proving on this issue… I don’t think he’s just ignoring the genocide altogether. he’s not trump.
there’s a lot that biden could have done ages ago. as things looked back when it first became obvious (at least to me,); if Biden had vetoed the aid package, that likely would have signaled a seachange in the dems and made the package not-super-majority proof.
it would’ve also denied aid to ukraine as well as humanitarian aid to palestine, and if the package hadn’t been cucked by republicans so hard it would’ve also denied the border funding as well, though they blocked that independently themselves.
But the first big one, they did lump it in with Ukraine and Taiwan specifically to get that stuff through republicans. Biden could have at any time vetoed the spending bills.
this is extremely normal with large funding bills like this, it’s just how you get these bipartisan supported bills through.
he could also have admited that they’re doing a genocide- or at the very least fucking warcrimes and be like “we need to hold onto that while you sort yourself out.”
i mean yeah, but the US hasn’t exactly had the cleanest record when it comes to war crimes either. I mean we started numerous wars for shits and giggles.
It’d be nice to see this conflict resolved, but unfortunately i think a really big detriment to that goal currently is a lot of the palestine dialog that is just super aggressive and highly toxic. It also doesn’t help that it seems to be their only issue that they care about. Single issue voting has never once solved a problem. I think a lot of the democratic dialog right now is very front facing, there’s very little focusing on actual policy and specific issues that aren’t extremely marketable. Shit like palestine just isn’t a massive concern for the majority of the population, though i’m sure they would prefer it stopped. I imagine there’s going to be a lot of behind the scenes work to clean this shit up, if they get elected. Democrats tend to be all bite no bark.