Trump winning supports the genocide of every LGBTQ+ person in all of North America, be it directly or indirectly. No one wants what is happening in Gaza. But, I have to say the potential genocide (in the sense of complete erasure of culture as well as open murders with little to no consequences sense) here is even higher.
I have the unfortunate circumstance of being a trans woman in GA. I already have had to completely shut off most contact with people, both work and personal.
I’ve already had rocks thrown at me in an attempt to kill me (this was years ago, even). I already feel like I have to carry a gun. If things go the way they seem, I will even have to order in groceries because it will further empower the people that hate my existence.
The foreign policy is shit, no question. However, I don’t like the possibility of being raped and murdered by some asshole that thinks he understands Co² emissions after watching some video.
I have a lot to say here, especially as a very blue collar machinist. I will refrain, though.
In conclusion: by “avoiding” the genocide in Gaza (which would have in my opinion had a much higher chance of being resolved with Democratic policies), you have also doomed people like me to maybe live in fear for the rest of our lives.
“no one wants what is happening in gaza, but the potential genocide in north America is even higher”
Have you tried opening a newspaper recently? What is happening in Palestine is worse than anything else happening in the world; to say that your potential event could be worse than that is a tremendous display of ignorance and insensitivity.
I, obviously, disagree here. It’s all horrible. However, I have every incentive to vote for my own well being. My point in that statement wasn’t necessarily that it would be worse (I probably should have phrased things better, but I’m no writer), but I do think it could potentially be more impactful for the “West” in the sense that the US could, potentially, devolve into a state similar to Russia (or a large number of nation states) where anyone who is not straight or cisgendered will be persecuted to the point of erasure. And in my personal case, though I know this is anecdotal, potential murder.
You say it’s all horrible like it’s a comparable horror. It’s not. Leaving aside the fact that your described event is hypothetical (and I hope it will stay so, don’t get le wrong I fully support LGBTQ+ rights), comparing murder to planned ethnic cleansing and thousands of civilians lives lost is a negation of the horror Palestinian endure on a daily basis.
Ethnic cleansing, orientation or gender cleansing, I see them as the same. thing. Ever have someone physically assault you for pissing? The drive for murder and erasure is literally on the same scale. The difference has been the backing of a state. Now, that may very well change. We will now have idiots with guns threatening us to to “be normal.” And no, it’s not a comparable horror… yet. I fear for my life constantly.
And, again, I’d like to posit the other meaning of genocide - cultural erasure. This, I think, is very likely.
Trump will go along with whatever Israel wants to do. If Hamas was in power, I can all but guarantee they would be doing the same shit, if not worse.
ETA: I’m not advocating for what is going. I’m just rather pissed that so many people keep doing the counterproductive thing of using this as a reason to vote trump or sit this out. Considering that Trump is worse in this regard and with global warming, humanities only chance is to ramp up efforts like the US is a lost cause, because for the next 2 years at least, we are.
Where have you seen that I’m advocating for Trump? I’m not even American! Every time I see someone criticizing the role of the US government in the Palestinian massacre, somebody come and says “yes but Trump”. I know trump is worse, can I still criticize the current US government or do I have to wait for the campaign to be over?
You have every right to criticize. I really and truly do empathize with what you are saying, believe it or not. You never advocated for Trump. Things are just very tense here in the US. That isn’t an excuse, but maybe an explanation for our overall behavior.
Yeah not to downplay the horror in Gaza but you might want to look into what’s happening in Sudan, for example
But I agree comparing discrimination in the US to any of this is pretty crazy
I’m fully aware of what’s happening in Sudan, but since multiple humanitarian organisations have explained that what’s happening in Gaza is the worst they have ever seen, I think it’s safe to say that this is worse than any situation
Sources:
Regarding ‘destruction’ I’m sure Sudan can’t compete because these people had very little to begin with, but when you compare other numbers…
- 200k killed
- 10m refugees
And this comes on top on the previous genocide that just ended a few years ago and killed 300k…
I’m sure you can find plenty of people saying conflict X is ‘tha worst evah’ but that’s just part of their job
this meme implies that lives of americans has more worth than lives of gazans. your rage is justified but outlawing essential healthcare for lgbtq+ is not the same as a hostile military force genociding and ethnically cleansing you. bad meme all around.
They don’t care as long as it doesn’t affect them. Did you ever see dem voters wish death to biden or obama. They are brain washed into thinking lesser evil is better. Evil is evil no matter what. Trump 4 years and then maybe dem another 4 years and the cycle repeats.
Yes, we all know that enabling TWO genocides is much better. That must be what you think, considering that’s the direct result of your stance. The situation in Gaza was never going to change, but as for what COULD change, by fucking god, you sure made it change. It’s thanks to virtue signalers like you that we now have foreign genocide with a side of domestic trans-hunting.
You’re looking for someone to blame for Trump winning and decided to blame the wrong people because you’re angry and need an easier target. Not the 70 million Americans who voted for Trump eh? Not the Harris campaign staff who refused to let Palestinians endorse Harris at the DNC and were trying to get their community to join them?
No, blame other victims because only your suffering counts. We’re ALL suffering.
Dumb shit like this is why Trump won. Grow up or expect to lose in the future as well.
Trump won because rich people wanted him to, not because of niche memes on statistically insignificantly known websites.
Posting on lemmy is the equivalent to when I used to post on Final Fantasy themed bulletin boards in the mid 90s
I feel for your very unfortunate situation, but maybe you should’ve demanded more from your party, instead of putting the blame on people who draw the line at genocide. If the choice is between the number of genocides, maybe we should take a step back and reflect a little because this doesn’t stop anywhere. Next time there will be two, three…
Republicans can go as fascist as they want, but if the Democrats are drugged in this race to the right, they will lose. They endorsed the wall, they did nothing about the immigrants and they 100% backed a genocide no questions asked, ever, what difference is an immigrant or Arab supposed to see from this?
No matter how much you accuse the people who didn’t vote, the truth of the matter is that nothing will change if you don’t demand from your party to stand for some values. For now, they follow Trump moving to the right.
I wasn’t the first to ask the question, but I haven’t heard an answer: If the genocide of Palestine is an acceptable price to pay to get a Democrat elected, then why wouldn’t trans genocide also be an acceptable price because of the threat to cis women? The utilitarian ethical calculation still works just fine.
I think you are asking the wrong person, I’m the one saying the Palestinian genocide crosses the line. Although I don’t 100% understand the logic behind this. What’s the threat to cis women?
Although I’m suspecting the answer someone would give you is that it’s because the trans genocide will happen to “us the US citizens” not some Arabs at the other side of the world we don’t really care that much about.
I don’t understand why only one group of people can be blamed.
Trump voters, non voters, the democratic party, etc all have varying amounts of blood on their hands. Be it the blood of Gazaouites, queer folks, immigrants, or simply women.
Because the democrats didn’t stand by any values that supposedly differentiated them from the republicans like I explained, but you don’t seem to really care. You can put it on non-voters or third party voters all you want, the truth is that Netanyahu got anything he ever wanted and asked for by the US under Biden and Harris and not acknowledging this is part of the problem. Immigrants got the same treatment under them as well, which I also mention and you don’t really care.
That’s the issue with not having any red line, you will always play by the rules of the far right. And that will make you indistinguishable from them which will alienate the people who want change. They don’t see an alternative to a very very dark situation. In good faith, you would very much understand why endorsing the wall, genocide Gaza and standing proudly by it, supporting Israel unwaveringly, not promoting any substantial progressive economic or ecological policies and in general why having an extreme neoliberal agenda would not compel people to vote for you.
It’s not on the disappointed voters that you people can’t understand what having a red line means. Consequentialism simply does not hold up when the difference are so miniscule and the evil is so big.
I’m really tired of going over this again and again, if you could feel a fraction of the pain the democrats and their oligarchs brought by committing the worst crime against humanity of the 21st century and how the millions of pleas for embargo went ignored this past year and a month, you wouldn’t be asking this.
I think there’s a slight misunderstanding. And a good part of it is on me.
First and foremost: democrats sucks. They suck so hard it’s honestly mind boggling that the republicans manage to beat them to the punch.
My point is that in that instance of first past the post election they’re the slightly less worst choice on a lot of issues, including Palestine (and yeah that previous slightly is doing a lot pf legwork). This is why one should vote for them. This is also why they need to be shamed and harassed into better stances.
I know it’s a heart wrenching choice. I should have worded my previous comment differently in order to establish that non voters where on the very bottom rung of the blame ladder.
But the US is a reprensentative Republic with a fucked up version of first past the post winner takes all voting (which is already fucked up in its own right). There are absolutely no good choices in that election. Only slightly less bad ones and whatever one can get away with while still retaining a modicum of sleep.
There should be riots about the Democrats, riots about the republicans, riots about how fragile the entire American political system is, riots about the election system where your vote only matters in a few select states, and some more riots for an unending list of reasons.
I do care, even if I’m not a US citizen and live in one of the regions where I’m the most sheltered against American tomfoolery (western Europe).
I just think that voting democrats in this election was the least uneffective way to do harm reduction.
Our party? Democrats are no more my party than Republicans are. They are objectively the better option for someone like me given the alternative, but in no way do they represent me. They are just another element of the capitalist corporate hegemony, and I’m just a consumer to them.
One is occupied, in an open air prison, being bombed, no food, no water and no one to aid them. The other may have some of their rights taken. Don’t compare the two.
The other may have some of their rights taken.
They may also be barred from exercising certain professions and be treated as all around second class citizens.
They may also be barred from life saving medications and procedures.
They will be subject to more violence up to and including murder and it may be swept under the rug.
At least be a bit more exhaustive. And they isn’t restricted to queer people. They’re also racized folks, muslim, jewish, or simply women.
And while I agree that there aren’t many situations which remotely might compare to the literal hell on earth that is Gaza, let’s not forget that a lot of other people are in sucky situations which will get worse as a result of that election.
