Considering how crazy expensive accommodations have become the last couple of years, concentrated in the hands of greedy corporations, landlords and how little politicians seem to care about this problem, do you think we will ever experience a real estate market crash that would bring those exorbitant prices back to Earth?
No, unless we separate housing from investment, it will never be affordable. I don’t foresee the political will to make it happen.
This is the biggest issue right here. Houses weren’t always investments and making them investments was a terrible idea that’s now difficult to fix.
Real estate has become a huge part of stock market and GDP figures. People’s retirement funds have become other people’s mortgage and rent payments. Affordable houses for some would mean economic decline for others, and no political party wants to create economic decline.
Maybe, but really the issue is construction of new houses. Cities are much cleaner now so people want to live in them. They used to be filled with factory smoke and animal feces.
Yes, more than now. No I don’t care that you saw some poop yesterday. The streets were literally caked with horse poop. You wouldn’t even notice dog poop.
And most jobs used to be physical, so the average person would have some experience in carpentry. If houses were too expensive, you would find a friend or relative with some expertise and build something yourself. So houses outside the city were cheap because you could build new ones, and houses inside the city sucked (and were cheap).
Part of high housing cost is due to the investment mindset and housing speculation. However, another part of high housing cost is that other people did put in the work to raise its value. Want to live in a clean, convenient neighborhood? Someone kept the place clean. Many businesses set up shop in the area to make it convenient to buy things and get things done. Certain passionate chef set up a wonderful restaurant so that you can just come by and enjoy good food. Some group of people, leader, or politician put in the political maneuverings that got certain ordinances passed or raised the bonds or taxes to build the public transportation. So over time as people continue to invest time, effort, labor to improve an area, it should be expected that the area becomes more expensive (and desirable).
“no political party wants to create economic decline.”
I’m afraid I have to disagree.
Yeah economic decline is actually being sold as the solution to global warming. It’s called “cutting back” but really it means making everyone poorer.
Still trying to understand how everything has to be crushed under capitalism. Food. Health care. Housing. Travel. It all there to spin up cash.
Can’t wait till they figure out how to monetize air 🫠
Can’t wait till they figure out how to monetize air
Saw this at a Walgreens last week.
These are really popular with people traveling to Colorado ski resorts and getting altitude sickness. They’re useful to grab to avoid getting sick and combating the symptoms if you do.
There are actually medical edgecases for stuff like this where they can be quite useful. That being said, a lot of people definitely also seem to view it as merely monetary, as there are literal oxygen bars in Vegas.
In the healthcare space they already have. If the wild fires keep up, it won’t be long before we have a Spaceballs or Lorax mogul in our midst.
Certain states such as Oregon (where I live) have acts in place regarding forests in general such as the FPA that should prevent the worst, or at least the destruction of forests whether imperatively or by wildfire, from happening.
However, when it comes to other places, I wouldn’t even be surprised unfortunately. On the California state border on Highway 199 crossing from Oregon where it’s mostly green, you see nothing but Redwoods burned and left in shambles for a few miles, it’s gives off goosebumps seeing a natural sight in this awful condition, let alone a supposedly protected state park.
I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say that it isn’t capitalisim that is doing this. Blaming capitalism for fucking the 99% is like blaming science for inventing nuclear weapons. Capitalism is just the process. The focus is determined by key players. Frankly, I’d blame the availability of just about every industry in the stock market for what we are seeing. Companies used to be run by industry experts, who had a vested interest in their business being a sustainable long term asset that would provide wealth to their family for generations. Now, companies are run by “Line Go Up” CEOs appointed by a board of stock holders (mostly financial bros) who just want the stock to look real good before they sell it. There is no concern for the customer, workers, or the general populace beyond government mandated standards. All that matters is making money for people who couldn’t care less or know less about the industry.
Capitalism didn’t ruin food or housing. Capitalists did.
Actually the stuff with the freeest (is that a word? How is that spelled??) markets tends to be the easiest to get and cheapest.
Medicine has uncontrolled price explosion because it’s an incredibly tightly constrained market. Food tends to be plentiful and cheap because it’s not very tightly constrained.
Yes, food did jump in price in the past couple of years … because of massive market interference when the governments dumped huge amounts of currency into the world, with only the upper classes having access to that new cash (it was given to corporations and to stockholders, leaving the lower class to watch their money devalue with no offset).
Housing is another tightly constrained market. You practically need positive permission from government in order to build anything, and there are tons of local constraints on what can be built.
I’m thinking of Boulder as an example where housing prices are skyrocketing, and construction is limited to a certain number of floors.
Capitalism is based on free markets. Where free markets exist goods become cheap and plentiful. But we have a lot of markets that aren’t free, for various reasons.
Investment is exactly what we need. We need more people to see building housing as a good investment, in order to get more housing.
The only other option is forcing people at gunpoint to build housing, and that only works for a couple of months then backfires.
Either you’re being a parody or you fit the stereotype. If the latter, what went so wrong in your life to make you care that much about money?
I honestly think were heading for a total societal collapse. If the people with power and resources were the sort that were inclined to use it for good, they would have done it already. Given that we haven’t seen this, it’s reasonable that this accumulation at the top will continue unabated and that more and more people will fall into poverty and despair.
This is a recipe for revolution, and revolution is largely incompatible with stability, especially in the near term.
I wish this wasn’t the case. I suspect this century’'s deaths will dwarf last century’s.
Look at other countries. Huge slums / shanty towns get built and normalized long before revolution.
If you’re living in a plywood shack, but still have a phone with data, some games to play, ebt / food bank to eat, you’re not about to pick up arms. At least most people in that spot won’t.
Maybe you’re right, but it’s also possible that people in those places have been living with those conditions all their lives and it creates a kind of apathy. If you take away everything from people who thought they’d have a kind of middle-class future, we don’t quite know what that looks like yet. I suspect it won’t be exactly the same.
It’s not about availability, it’s about willingness. If a revolution was attempted in America, like 80% of those who pick up arms would be gunned down in the first day.
Choosing between that, at just living the rest of your days eating beans and playing games on your phone in a shack? Let’s face it.
Not without some real force or change, middle class has invested to much of their retirement into the housing market to allow the prices to tank. Those who have are not going to risk it for the have nots.
Imagine storing all of your nation’s wealth in real estate that is actively decaying by the minute instead of into companies that make products and provide jobs. What a stupid fucking idea.
Doesn’t matter. Houses are sold for prices as if they’re still mostly new. If you are good you can beat down the price by a cost of a new roof or a new heating system. Never both. No seller will ever acknowledge that renovation doesn’t make sense and the house should be teared down, actively lowering the land value. And they don’t have to. Someone else is around the corner to buy at any price, turning it into an overpriced rental unit.
That’s because in most cases, you’re paying for the cost of the land, not the house itself. Just look at how much unimproved land costs. The house itself is a depreciating asset, the land appreciates so much that it overwhelms the cost of the house. Even condos are subject to this, simply because they take up space (which is worth money) and their price is tied to traditional houses because they are (imperfect) substitutes.
No. As the effects of climate change become worse, people will migrate to cooler places, which will only push up prices in those places. Poor people will be left to live in uninhabitable and uninsurable areas, while the rich will get to live in comfort.
Climate change is essentially a class struggle, like everything else in life. As long as the 1% don’t have to suffer, nothing will be done. To get the rich to do something about climate change, it will have to affect them directly.
I also think in addition to what you mentioned people don’t want to address that the population is a problem as well. The earth more than doubled the people living on it in 70 years from all of human history, that’s not just sustainable. You can hypothetically fit 20 people in a one bedroom but just because you can doesn’t mean you should.
I’m in a hot climate and it’s far more expensive here than it is in cooler parts of the country, and it continues to be that way. Your hypothesis would be for the distant future, but that’s not what’s driving costs right now and in the immediate future.
Sure, but the premise of the question is if “we will ever have affordable housing again in our lifetime?” There is no reason to believe there will be affordable housing right now or in the immediate future, and this comment hypothesises why climate change will cause affordable housing to continue to be problematic in the distant future as well.
limate change is essentially a class struggle, like everything else in life. As long as the 1% don’t have to suffer, nothing will be done. To get the rich to do something about climate change, it will have to affect them directly.
Exactly this. Elysium comes to mind, altough it won’t be a space station in orbit but probably a densely populated blue zone in Western Antarctica defended by turret boats or some shit.
No. Expensive housing is a genie in a bottle.
Once sufficient people have purchased a house at the high price, it would be in their interest for prices to remain high. Corporate entities that buy up houses will actively lobby to make sure housing prices stay high, and the average Joe who paid that much for a house will be happy it stays that way.
I’m not so sure. Large lobbies have greater economic power than us average people, but they aren’t strong enough to defy macroeconomic trends. There are many factors that could turn and cause prices to collapse, we just don’t know when or if they will occur.
The only factors that can cause the collapse of a captured market are regulation, total market collapse, or revolution.
