29 points

Very cool, hopefully other companies take note.

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22 points

Can someone explain to me what this means? I’m technologically inept when it comes to privacy, slowly getting better day-by-day thanks to Lemmy.

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4 points

It means that even though Mullvad already doesn’t log anything about their users activities, there is no persistent storage on the servers, so as soon as it is powered off or raided by The Agencies, there is absolutely nothing to retrieve from it.

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1 point
*

No data is supposed to be readable after you shut it off. There are ways to restore it though but it’s still vastly better in leaving no trace.

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1 point

If the computer is unplugged, there’s nothing left on a hard drive to show what state it was in. This means nobody malicious can physically remove their servers and gain information about customers.

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86 points

What does “without any disks in use” mean?

  • If the computer is powered off, moved or confiscated, there is no data to retrieve.
  • We get the operational benefits of having fewer breakable parts. Disks are among the components that break often. Therefore, switching away from them makes our infrastructure more reliable.
  • The operational tasks of setting up and upgrading package versions on servers become faster and easier.
  • Running the system in RAM does not prevent the possibility of logging. It does however minimise the risk of accidentally storing something that can later be retrieved.
    https://mullvad.net/en/blog/2022/1/12/diskless-infrastructure-beta-system-transparency-stboot/
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31 points

While mostly true, there are ways to preserve ram if the device is confiscated.

Your local PD likely couldn’t pull it off, but if one of the larger abbreviation agencies were to get involved, data on RAM isn’t a huge hurdle. Assuming no one flips the power switch, at least.

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13 points
*

I guess it’s going to stop any standard agencies with a warrant. Confiscating the machine for it to sit in a warehouse until some forensic techs get their hands on it.

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20 points

Yeah, freezing and dumping RAM is a well known attack, even happening at some airports with laptops. But it still requires very recently powered ram, basically still in operation before extraction. It’s a big step toward security at least.

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3 points

There are devices that allow moving and confiscating computers without powering them off.

The rest are true.

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4 points

That’s assuming those computers weren’t already powered off first.

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1 point
Deleted by creator
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7 points
*

I’m not an expert but I think : The site you visit only sees the VPNs info. Which is how you maintain some anonymity while browsing. However, if your VPN keeps logs, then you can still be tracked, just at a different place. Some say they don’t keep logs, and you’d have to trust that.

RAM is considered volatile memory, so each time the server turns off, it loses all data. This is compared to disk (hard drives of whatever type) which retain memory even if the server turns off.

In theory, this ram only server prevents them from keeping logs (like which user went where) since the server wouldn’t even have a place to store it.

Edit: lustrums post is more accurate and has info that this doesn’t prevent logging per se, but could prevent accidental logging. I.e. they can’t hire a forensic computer specialist to parse through operating system logs to try to find info they didn’t otherwise log elsewhere.

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3 points
*

The site you visit only sees the VPNs info. Which is how you maintain some anonymity while browsing.

A VPN just changes your IP, all your browser info is still visible to the website.

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1 point

It does hide where your traffic is going to the ISP, no?

Mullvad also has their own browser that has some security features that prevent fingerprinting while also keeping an okay level of usability.

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2 points

Some say they don’t keep logs, and you’d have to trust that. Note that this same caveat applies for a VPN provider promising they are running diskless endpoints. Or that they don’t have some third party monitoring their stuff even if diskless. Or that a law enforcement agency can’t come along with a warrant to require them to monitor an account’s activity moving forward, even if logs are not possible.

If your online activity justifies this level of paranoia, there’s probably no meaningful protection available for your wants in practice. If your provider is operating in a jurisdiction that is problematic for your online activity, they can probably ultimately be compromised. If you are just using it to access a different country’s streaming library, you probably don’t need to be that paranoid. If you are trying to disguise illegal activity that is illegal in the jurisdiction of the VPN endpoint, well you are likely boned with logging or not.

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6 points

A normal computer is usually constantly writing little bits and pieces of data to disk. But data on the disk might accidentally remain on the disk even if it’s not intended. Then that data could be read later by someone else who is spying on VPN users .

There’s also a common assumption that data on disk storage may leave behind remnants even after it’s been overwritten. (Magnetic disks may leave behind some magnetic signatures. Flash drives will stop using sectors that are worn out, potentially leaving data there.) And state actors like NSA might have some capability to recover this ghost data if they get a hold of the actual drives.

There’s a general understanding that data on RAM is irrevocably destroyed within a short time after the device loses power. So attacks on RAM data have to occur in real time while the data is in use. (There may be some attacks that preserve RAM after power down using low temperatures and liquid nitrogen).

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-19 points

I do not use a VPN provider but damn, that’s cool as hell. Now how do I self host it? :D

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40 points

Wouldn’t that defeat the purpose of a VPN?

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17 points
*

Not if you want to VPN to your home.

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3 points

But why would logs you hurt than?

How to debug and how to do forensic if only the supposed persons are connected to your home, if you don’t have any logs?

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5 points

Self hosting would essentially just be using a ramdisk. If you want to be crazy about it, you could even run a VM with its storage entirely within a ramdisk.

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10 points

Just run wireguard on a ram only vm at your home

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7 points

You already are. It’s called using your own connection. You don’t need to be your own middleman, shuffling data to/from yourself.

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1 point

Note that the lack of logging probably doesn’t matter when your self-hosting, since it’s all for you.

Concept of RAM only Linux images with validation and signing is something seen in some datacenters. For example, Lenovo has this in their confluent cluster management (https://hpc.lenovo.com/). A node can network boot or boot from usb (read-only) and all writes go to RAM.

Alternatively, booting a LiveCD amounts to the same thing without requiring a boot server, you have a local ‘disk’ but nothing writes to it. If extra paranoid you could actually boot it from a burned DVD, but in practice even when booting from USB most ‘live’ images only write filesystem to RAM.

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34 points

Great news! Mullvad is great even if their account security makes you do a double take

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23 points

what do you mean?

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26 points

I assume they mean there are no account credentials. When you “create” an account on their website, you’ll be given a random account number, and no password.

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17 points

Yeah this is what I meant. It feels so wrong but also makes complete sense.

I think I’ve gotten used to the “safety” of setting my own password and always typing it with my email or username.

But practically speaking they’re very similar and Mullvad’s is arguably safer

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1 point

What’s to stop somebody guessing your account number and gaining access? (Honest question)

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5 points

I am surprised that they don’t provide UUIDv4’s, feels like what they provide is somewhat guessable

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3 points
*

https://mullvad.net/en/blog/2017/6/20/mullvads-account-numbers-get-longer-and-safer/

As they outline here, there are ~9 quadrillion possible keys, needing around 5.5 million guesses to find an account. I think they hit a nice middleground between decent entropy and still having a number you can memorize (like a credit card).

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1 point

people memorize their credit card numbers?

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1 point

To be fair, would it matter if someone got access to your account key? There isn’t really any data on your account is there (isn’t that the point)? It’d just let you connect to the VPN

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1 point

They can use your secondary connection for free. It depends if that bothers you or not. If you’re already using both it could lead to disruption on your part I guess? Not 100% on that though

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107 points

Last time I looked at VPNs, mullvad seemed highly recommended for privacy and security. Sounds like it may still be the case.

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85 points

I also like that you don’t have to give them any private info at all to make an account. You can just send crypto and they’ll give you an account code and that’s it, you don’t even need an email address.

I haven’t tried it but apparently you can even mail them cash. You get a payment token and just send cash in an envelope and they’ll activate it whenever the money shows up!

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33 points

I personally use this and it works great. Takes like a week to arrive (sending from europe).

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13 points

you can also buy physical tokens (scratch cards with activation codes) in a shop, with cash

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8 points

And which shops sell those tokens?

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23 points

It’s basically the gold standard, audited and proven. I hear good things about IVPN as well.

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4 points

Be aware that Mullvad recently removed support for port forwarding if that matters to you. They’re no longer a preferred option for torrents for that reason. Other than that I enjoy using their service.

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