“When a defendant honestly believes he can’t possibly get a fair trial from the judge, one of the tactics is to antagonize the judge to a point of causing reversible errors,” Dershowitz says. “That is what happened in the Chicago 7 case, and I was one of the lawyers on the appeal in that case. Abbie Hoffman provoked Judge Hoffman to such a degree that the judge made mistake after mistake. And courts of appeal often reverse convictions or verdicts when the judge has made serious errors.”
What a dick. This does not sound like the legal process at work at all. Besides, innocent people would never do this.
The tactics have included attacks on Engoron’s court clerk, filibustering the prosecution’s witnesses with repetitive questions, and raising legal arguments the judge had already specifically prohibited.
Responding to these provocations with contempt charges is correct and proper. Any appeal court judge is going to see that Trump was treated with kid gloves here.
And it kinda doesn’t matter what political party the appeal judge is. They really don’t like people being disrespectful to them and ignoring their orders. It’s like the number one thing all judges hate. This strategy will probably not work.
I don’t know about that last part so much. Current conservatives have shown that there is no level that they won’t sink to and no level of hypocrisy they won’t espouse.
It’s so dumb that an appeal for a mistrial can get the whole case thrown out rather than simply retried with a different judge
As the article mainly states, this isn’t just because Trump can’t help it but also as a strategy to make it easier to get a favorable appeal. Plus, it would stoke his favorite way to portray himself, as a victim, and fundraising:
there have been recent conversations among some of Trump’s 2024 campaign brass of how much of an immediate fundraising boost they would enjoy, if a New York judge were to try to put Trump in a cell for even a minute. “All the cash in the world,” one Trump political adviser says.
I think the solution here would be for the judge to go after Trump’s lawyers. From the article they’re engaging in some of this behavior themselves, in addition to encouraging it in Trump. But, they want the optics of Trump getting imprisoned in order to play victim and try to help an appeal. Seems the judge could side step that and go after the lawyers instead, who have more to lose.
Can the judge jail the lawyers for repeatedly violating his orders? They should know better than to antagonize the court.
Sure. A judge can hold anyone in contempt of court, and they can fine or jail them for any length of time.
But could you hold a lawyer in contempt of court for something their client tweeted? That doesn’t seem likely.
It seems like putting a lawyer in jail would just be a recipe for delaying a trial though. They can’t be expected to provide defense if they’re locked up. Or do they just require you to find new counsel?
According to two sources familiar with the matter and another person briefed on Team Trump’s legal strategies, the former president and his lawyers are intentionally trying to provoke the judge into a nuclear-level overreaction.
This? Is the plan?
That’s like saying you’re going to kill a dragon by hopping into its mouth.
Overreaction?
How is it an overreaction when any normal person would have been tossed in jail months or even years ago?
Normal people don’t have a few thousand people out there waiting for an excuse to shoot people.
But they should jail Trump anyway. When you have such a dangerous following, it’s even more important that the law come down hard.
According to two sources familiar with the matter and another person briefed on Team Trump’s legal strategies, the former president and his lawyers are intentionally trying to provoke the judge into a nuclear-level overreaction.
I think Trump’s legal strategy is he knows he’s lost already. He’s going to be fined and run out of business. So is his only hope is if he and his lawyers are obnoxious dicks and provoke a reaction to force a mistrial or grounds for appeal. Also he can whine about “witch hunt” and the usual nonsense to his base if he’s found in contempt or held accountable for his actions. Expect this nonsense to happen in his criminal trials too.
I think Trump’s legal strategy is he knows he’s lost already.
I’m pretty sure he has lost already and guilt has been legally decided. This is to determine the penalty. FTA:
Engoron ruled in September that Trump’s financial statements contained fraud.
This trial is to determine the depth of the fraud, and importantly, the consequence appropriate depending on the outcome. The whole strategy now is to delay and get to appeal probably with the number one goal being to get elected again and create a legal quagmire, or simply ride out the rest of his years until his milkshake-filled arteries realize he hasn’t ever had a heart and the only thing that’s been pumping this long is pure narcissism.
This is, sadly, probably the least stupid thing he could do, because the more facts you learn about Trump, the more you’d think his fetish is just bending over and getting fucked by a strap-on wielding Lady Justice.
If the judge loses it bad enough, they can claim “judicial bias” and have a pretty clear path to mistrial/appeal. Given the situation, it’s probably the best play they have.
Any normal defendent would be in jail though, probably before the trial even started, but definitely after calling a judge names while in court. I’m simultaneously shocked and not at all surprised he isn’t.
Dude needs to stand before a firing line, not go to jail.
That’s a lil extreme my guy
Edit: what fuckin world do we live in, where someone says that a politician needs to be shot to death, and the controversial opinion is to not shoot someone? Am I crazy for thinking that killing trump wouldn’t solve anything? We shouldn’t give people a martyr. The best way to get rid of someone is by shaming them and forgetting them.
“Furthermore, 18 U.S.C § 2381, states that a person guilty of treason against the United States “shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.”
When he says that on a fringe social media platform it’s “lil extreme”
When Trump says that 5 thugs need to be put to death, who were found Innocent, it’s just an opinion everyone is allowed to.
Uh no, that’s also an extreme opinion. Death is always an extreme opinion, because there’s no way to change your mind. Death is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
Not sure about this really. You have a great point with the martyr risk, but then again, if Hitler had been executed in 1924, would the whole nazi thing have fallen on its face? Trumpism (much like Hitlerism) is a person cult. Perhaps killing their leader is exactly the kind of thing what people like Trump supporters respect and positively respond to.
The best way to get rid of someone is by shaming them
I think we can be pretty certain that this strategy is not working against Trump. Unless you find a shaming angle that actually works against his supporters. I have no idea what that could be since just about every angle that would work on normal people has been tried out.
To respond to your edit:
Death as a punishment for treason would do a lot to stem the tide of treasonous fucks that are currently holding high positions in our political system.
The time for leniency is OVER. And making a martyr out of a huge sack of shit is just fine- let more of those fucks step out of line and see what happens.
Do you really think that’s how it’d go down? You might want to rethink that one.
Not really. It’s in line with all US laws to ask for the death penalty
18 U.S.C § 2381, states that a person guilty of treason against the United States “shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.”
Considering the scope and impact of his crimes. It would be reasonable to ask for the maximum punishment.
Boy let me tell you something about our founding fathers… This man tried to destroy our democracy, he deserves to die. However, for the sake of our civilized society I would prefer to see him rot in jail until he dies in the most unglamorous way possible that way he can’t be made a martyr.
I guess he is daring NY Judge, because it is a civil case.
He probably should have his release conditioned on gag order in federal cases. And he should be jailed if he breaks it.
If the fear is that his fans will riot, newsflash: they follow identity politics, they don’t care how guilty trump is. Whatever they plan to do, they will do it anyway. So either treat him like you would treat anyone else for similar crimes or just forget about trials and let him do whatever he wants without any consequence. Because there’s no point in wasting time if he can’t be punished.
