spoilers ahead I felt like the character conflict arcs were contrived and ultimately the idea of learning a language makes you a pre-cog fell flat for me. In science fiction, the big idea goes ‘woo!’ or the characters go ‘woo!’ but in the case of Arrival, nothing really went ‘woo!’

But maybe I’m wrong - what was I missing about Arrival?

60 points

Arrival presents some good philosophical questions, and does so in an interesting setting. The top questions are:

  • How does language affect our perception?
  • If you knew your fate, would you still do things the same way?

As such it’s qualitatively a good Sci-Fi film. Should it be ranked as one of the best? I don’t know, and honestly I don’t care, because such rankings are always subjective.

permalink
report
reply
9 points
*

How does language affect our perception?

Philip K. Dick is famous for saying ‘reality is that in which, when you stop believing in it, does not go away.’ Languages, perceptions, are still materially beliefs and changing beliefs doesn’t change reality. I wanted to see HOW the language allowed you to perceive time and it never got there.

permalink
report
parent
reply
25 points

I don’t think some pseudo science jargon about tachyons in her delta waves would have enhanced the story. The how isn’t important, what matters is the way it changes her life and how she deals with it. It’s an exploration of the Sapir-Worf hypothesis but given more of an emotional tinge. I also loved the design of the aliens and the way they living outside linear time affected their culture and personalities.

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

I don’t think some pseudo science jargon about tachyons in her delta waves would have enhanced the story.

Its not. It doesnt try to give a hard science explanation, it gives an explanation of perspective that offers actual insight. Ted Chiang doesn’t write hard science fiction, but it’s very well thought out science fiction, imo.

permalink
report
parent
reply
12 points

I wanted to see HOW the language allowed you to perceive time and it never got there.

Interestingly enough the short story on which Arrival is based on, Story of Your Life, goes a bit into this. I’m not going to spoil it because it’s super cool.

permalink
report
parent
reply
10 points

It’s not about perception changing reality it’s the other way around. The movie is a meditation on the Sapir Worf hypothesis, that the structure of language literary changes how you perceive the world.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points
*

So, I think if there’s an issue with Arrival, it’s the whiplash of using a hard[ish] sci-fi structure to address the first question, then zoom straight into the second. We’re given a pretty solid, small story about how we might plausibly handle first contact, and specifically the linguistic aspect of it, but the truth that comes out of it is that it was language itself which is the key to transcending space and time, and all so we can ruminate on the philosophical equivalent of “Should we love our pets when we know they live shorter, smaller lives than us?”

It’s quite the flex for the movie we were watching, and feels a little unearned. There was definitely a little bit of “I’m stoned and this is deep”. As a dog owner, I at least appreciate that the answer was “yes,” LOL.

I do still think it’s good and it was very well done. Many movies wouldn’t even be worth this discussion.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

I think it’s a good Sci-Fi film, but we’re more interested in a good sci-fi movie.
Ya know?

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points

it’s a linguistic drama with a sci-fi coat of paint.

The Importance of being Earnest with aliens.

permalink
report
parent
reply
28 points

I love Arrival, it’s one of my favorites. The scene where she meets with the Chinese general at the gala was chilling, I love how she herself is confused for most of the movie and formulates her plan in that moment, in collaboration with him. I also love that the reason for first contact is that the aliens will need help centuries in the future, that’s a pretty unique spin on the usual story.

The piece about her daughter is interesting I think but it’s not the strongest part of the movie. I was disappointed that they shoehorn the romance at the end and have her and Ian fall in love. Honestly I would have been fine never knowing who her husband was, because the poignancy of the story was her own personal choices about having a child.

permalink
report
reply
17 points

Also it’s not that it makes you a pre-cog, it’s more that it makes you unstuck in time, Billy Pilgrim style. She was perceiving her life nonlinearly.

permalink
report
parent
reply
20 points

I’d suggest reading the original short story, Story of Your Life, by Ted Chiang. It makes the underlying premise much clearer.

Learning the heptapod language doesn’t make you precognitive. It unlocks time as a dimension, allowing you to navigate forward and backward through time the same way you do through space. It causes you to “remember” things that you will experience in the future and apply those memories to your present experience. You start experiencing all of time at once, instead of in a regimented sequence.

The overall effect is the realization that the arrow of time is an illusion, with questions about what that means for free will, fate, predestination.

The movie itself is good, but it’s a great adaptation of the source material, which is incredibly difficult to translate to film. Just the way it starts by fooling you into thinking the main character is at a later stage of her own life than she really is while later revealing what she’s actually experiencing was really handled well in the script.

permalink
report
reply
8 points

I thought that the reveal of the heptapods being much larger creatures, and our earlier understanding of them to be based on the characters limited perception, to be a really neet allusion to the overall premise of the story as well.

permalink
report
parent
reply
16 points
*
Deleted by creator
permalink
report
reply
9 points

Off topic, but this here really hit home for me (not a linguist student but someone plenty interested).

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

this is amazing

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Sapir Worf : the feature film

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

That was one of my favorite episodes of TNG.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

When the walls fell!

permalink
report
parent
reply
4 points

I thought Arrival was a good spin on time-travel. The information travels backward in time, but it is resolved - a consistent timeline results (as far as we witness it, at least). Good sequel could be to fast forward whatever it was . . . 3 millennia and see the intelligent cockroaches from Earth arriving to save the hecapods after the knowledge the hecapods bequeathed led the humans to promptly self-annihilate, opening the path for cockroach evolution.

permalink
report
reply
2 points

Haha awesome take!

permalink
report
parent
reply

Science Fiction

!scifi@kbin.social

Create post

This magazine is aimed at fans and creators of sci-fi and related media of all kinds. It includes all content related to the sci-fi genre and only content related to the sci-fi genre. The goal is to build a community for everyone who enjoys science fiction and related topics. This includes the obvious books, movies, and TV shows, but also original writing, the discussion of writing SF, futuristic art and designs, and the science and technologies that inspire the sci-fi genre. **Team Top 20**

Community stats

  • 1

    Monthly active users

  • 774

    Posts

  • 2.3K

    Comments

Community moderators