I don’t think there is a single person behaves that way online that thinks it doesn’t change the person they are IRL. It’s just online they have the balls to be the person they really want to be.
I know a couple of people (brothers) who definitely thought that online wasn’t real and they could act without any consequences in their real life. This was back in the 00’s when social media was just catching on. They were absolutely awful to real life friends online and then acted like nothing happened in person. They lost pretty much every friend they had as a result of it. I still don’t talk to either of them. We tried to explain to them multiple times that it was absolutely unacceptable behavior, and they thought it was funny.
I never said that they weren’t. I’m just saying I don’t believe anybody looks at their online behavior and thinks ‘thats not the real me that doesn’t count.’
Several comments here provide evidence to the contrary.
And maybe that’s the problem. The people who are assholes online don’t think about there being real, earnest people behind the other keyboards.
Anonymity and the abstraction of interacting online can and does weaken the sense of social contract for many people, unfortunately.
And it does count. Because what one says online can and does affect others in a real way.
I duno i have definitely seen people argue the internet isn’t real and none of it counts. I think people definitely try to justify it to themself like that. Like if a trans person complains about online harassment, that argument gets used a lot to dismiss it as lesser or not really important.
I dunno. I agree and I don’t. I am part of a gaming community where RPing and ERPing is a decent chunk of subscribers. It does not appeal to me, but does that make them a catboi that will lick the back of their paws for a million gil? I kinda doubt that.
Actually I just need to address this a little further because this is a beautiful example of what I’m discussing. All I did was post my opinion and you came along being a condescending ass about it. Do you believe that doesn’t count towards who you really are?
Wow so touchy. Not only was that not condescending, it was lighthearted. Yet you’re just too fucking miserable to not make it personal huh?
Zizek says that our online persona is our real persona, because it doesn’t have the weights and limitations of our physical bodies and can be free to express as itself.
I don’t know, this sounds very mind body duality to me but I don’t think it’s reasonable to assume such a duality exists?
I think being removed from legal or social ramifications enables a lot of misbehavior. If there were social or legal ramifications for online behavior, then maybe people would behave consistently online and offline. In fact, you see that with places like LinkedIn.
Before social media, “trolling” was a game of inciting reactions without malicious intent. IIRC the norm was to induce anger or reaction or exhaustion without using violent language, like death threats etc. But of course people always behave stupidly for any number of reasons! The death threat people, from my old school pov, are not OG trolls. The death threat people are politically motivated actors or sociopaths.
So I think it’s less about being real online vs fake, and more about what you’re doing vs everyone else. If you’re looking for a cozy time online, then someone coming in to incite reaction by being contrarian (because that’s interesting to them) would seem aggravating to you, and that’s just unkind of the contrarian person (or troll).
If you’re shitposting and assume everyone is just a troll trolling trolls (and that’s true), then all interactions are performative and a game. However this cannot apply anymore because the rules of engagement on the web have changed, and there a lot more people online now with different needs and different expectations. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being inclusive. The chans etc. are filled with glowies or nation state actors, so it’s not worth engaging in old school trolling in any form because you just provide convenient camouflage for people with malicious intent or political agendas.
So in short no, I don’t think body vs non body is the reason for differences in irl or online behavior.
If you’re shitposting and assume everyone is just a troll trolling trolls (and that’s true), then all interactions are performative and a game. However this cannot apply anymore because the rules of engagement on the web have changed, and there a lot more people online now with different needs and different expectations. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being inclusive.
Maybe I just have an old school mentality about this, but wouldn’t this be kinda, a better stance to take, even if you were looking for a cozy time online? Would it not be the more accommodating position? A troll is easier to dismiss out of hand for being bad faith, rather than assuming someone who’s good faith, but inflammatory, has entered into your space and decided to talk shit and incite reaction. One of those cuts it off before you spend more thought process on it. Thought terminating cliches are useful sometimes, for controlling your own behavior and not engaging with that which you do not wish to seriously engage. Which, I think, is something we need more much of, online. The fallacies are fine, it’s just that they are meant to be helpful to you, personally, rather than being a kind of, moral creed to which we all must conform, a creed that must be enforced, if not by strict rule, than by a kind of unspoken social norm, by chastisement.
I think probably it’s also weird that people comment like “this person is a troll” or “this person is a bot” as like, a kind of weird flag that’s supposed to be helpful, but then they expect not to get engaged with after they post that, by the poster. I’m not super convinced the people doing that “flagging” are always doing it in good faith, though, anyways.
I think this as well. People in on-line video games are so quick to flame, troll, and ruin a game. But Ask them if they think it reflects poorly on them and they’ll either get defensive, victim-blame, or say they were just joking. They complain about having bad community scores in these games, and blame literally everyone else before they can admit any semblance of culpability. Saw it in DOTA 2, saw it in Smite, and every other online forum.
However, we all lose our cool sometimes. I am usually the chillest dude on the server, but if I’ve had 3 games in a row of being flamed, trolled, having teammates quit, and on that fourth game some teammate “woohoo’s” my death? I’m already so steamed from the previous games that I’ll unleash a nasty comment right back, even if the dude accidentally hit the wrong emoticon thing. And if they are legit trolling, and I’m fed up? yeah, that’s definitely a nasty message right back at’em.
I guess I’m trying to say, we all lose our cool on-line once in a while, just like we all lose our cool in real life once in a while. Those once-in-a-while situations don’t define us, as long as most-of-the-time we’re chill. But if you’re edging towards losing your cool most-of-the-time, with your chill moments only once-in-a-while? then yeah, man. you’re the a-hole.
The only difference is that if you do it online and not in real life, you’re a coward, two-faced, or both.
The true test of a person’s character is what he they do when no one is watching.
with no apologies to john wooden
