Incase anyone tells you that lemmy.ml is not a tankie instance.
Everyone’s just throwing away their masks left and right. Left is becoming full-blown marxist/leninist, right is becoming actual nazis.
Anarchists: Are we a joke to you? Yes? Fair enough. We’ll be over listening to folk punk and reminiscing about Dr. King being right in his Letter from Birmingham Jail.
The extremists in the anarchist movement are the ones who pretend everyone would just work together fine and self-organize if there was no government at all, aren’t they? Or am I thinking of a different group.
Those aren’t extremists, they’re children. I’m not saying that as an insult, I mean it literally.
Actual, practicing anarchists are extremely bureaucratic. Ironically, anarchy in practice produces large, democratic governments that change slowly. Hilariously, a small republican government is best suited for making rapid progress. Note the lower case (d) and (r) - I’m referring to ideology, and not political parties.
Anarchists create institutions that reflect democratic values, and when everyone must be given a chance to have a say, meetings are huge and take for-fucking-ever (speaking from lived commune experience here). Cliques and factions form and work together to shut down proposals they don’t like. Its actually a very conservative ideology - nothing changes quickly.
I’d say that those “extremists” are more likely people who are young (either biologically or in exposure to anarchic philosophy) and a bit naïve. They may have their heart in the right place from the perspective of those of us who have been about for a while but, likely are lacking in real-world experience with anarchic social circles and challenges that they have (wreckers, narcissists, cliques, etc).
What you’re mentioning is more of the shallow view of anarchism that’s most frequently portrayed as the alternative to the other popular Mad Max view that right-of-center groups like to use to portray “anarchy”. Neither are great at showing the full gamut of anarchic philosophy nor particularly accurate portrayals of extant or historical approaches to non-hierarchical societies.
Big up to the Anarchists. I’d love to be one but the best I could do is some evenings and every other weekend. I’ve become a decadent westerner in the last couple of decades. Sad face.
To me, the most important role of anarchism is as a “North Star”. My ideal society (something like anarcho-syndicalism) is not going to happen in my life. Easier to accept as a full adult. However, that doesn’t mean abandoning the ideals. It means examining them and the pre-conditions necessary to achieve them. Things like cultivating community and encouraging pro-social behaviors that are necessary to change culture for the better over time.
Maybe when xers, millennials, zoomers, and alphas are and to finally take the reins and have some semblance of control over their own lives we will be able to see more change but for now, building and support is needed so that we don’t repeat things like the failed revolution in Iran that led to a theocracy.
Hey, as a non-authoritarian leftist, I can assure that MLs are just a subset that really wants to pretend they’re spearheading the Left to fulfill their bloodbath fantasies. There’s lots of us that don’t like them and aren’t like them at all.
Please be sure to draw a clear distinction between Marxism and Marxism-Leninism.
Like, MLs are doing literally what Marx saw in 1848 and spent the rest of his life firmly against - you can’t just will a revolution into existence. Even if the world would be better if you could. You can make a good go of it, you can die nobly in the attempt, you can even maybe overthrow the current elite - but what comes next is not going to be socialist, it’s not going to be a worker’s state, and very likely it’s not going to last. No matter how hard you believe in the virtue and intellect of your vanguard party.
Lmao of course this place is ran by hardcore war crime apologist PugJesus who advocates for jailing Edward Snowden and Julian Assagne.
You wanna post a screenshot where they say those people should be jailed?
Sure I’m a NATO apologist: I’m sorry NATO is necessary because Russia is such an antagonistic fuckwad.
The world was deeply afraid of Marxism. When Russia experienced a workers-led revolution in 1917, Western powers were terrified of the spread of Marxist ideas and the potential threat they posed to the capitalist world order. In response, several Western states, along with their client states, sent their armies into Russia, aiming to overthrow the newly established worker-run government under the Bolsheviks. We attacked first, in an effort to suppress a system we feared.
This antagonism continued and evolved over the decades, culminating in the Cold War, where tensions between the Soviet Union and the West defined global politics. The Cuban Missile Crisis stands out as a key moment in this conflict. In fact, it was the United States that, in violation of international norms and against the Geneva Convention, installed nuclear launch sites along Russia’s borders in Turkey, heightening the threat and contributing to the Soviet response of placing missiles in Cuba.
Historically, it’s clear that we have been antagonistic towards Russia, driven by a fear of communism and a desire to maintain Western dominance. This pattern of confrontation has had long-lasting effects on the geopolitical landscape, contributing to the strained relations that persist today.
Dont take my word for this stuff, you can easily find information online, in text books.
Not to defend Western European imperialism in Russia because fuck that but no one did more to destroy the newly established worker-run government than the Bolsheviks. I’m assuming you’re a ML–unfortunately they don’t allow factual discussions of history, so you’ll need to read some history outside of the thought bubble to learn the truth.
Trotskyist, so all up for discussion and challenging my understanding. Point me in the direction.
Actual quote from Vladimir Putin:
Dear NATO, we regret being imperialist bastards. We regret coming to Ukraine. And we most definitely regret that the VMSU just blew up our raggedy-ass fleet!
Russia had a choice: play by the west’s rules, or play second fiddle to China. They chose the latter unfortunately for them and for us.
That’s just what happens when you go from tsarist serfdom state to a communist peasant regime to a “democractic” dictatorship while constantly greasing the gears with vodka and corruption.
I’d be glad if NATO didn’t exist.
It would mean countries wouldn’t feel threatened by their neighbors, and no invasions would happen.
But until that is the case, NATO is necessary.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Gladio
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_massacre#False_leads
NATO isn’t there to defend you, it’s there to serve the interests of a bunch of rulers and elites
That might be hard to grasp but sometimes the interests or rulers and elites do align to some degree with the average person in their country. Most rich and powerful people have a lot of investments that are worth significantly less when unpredictable things such as invasions happen that disrupt trade.
Humanity is literally on the verge of extinction due to global warming and you still believe rulers gives a single shit to anything that isn’t money or power? War is a business.
I mean the rulers and elites live in the same countries as many of us do and they sure as shit don’t want war where they live. It might not be here to defend us, but it’s here to defend the countries we live in.
War is a business and a tool to get more power. Rulers and elites cares about money and wealth they don’t give a fuck about the planet or peasants. Just look around yourself
Every species has weapons embedded into its body, some organisms are specialized members of the species, such as queens and babies, but all species spend a portion of their precious energy budget building weapons.
Given how ruthlessly evolution prunes out anything that doesn’t give an advantage, I think this gives significant information about the nature of existence.
Hostility appears to be as universal as entropy, and just as manageable.
Fun fact. Being the most complex object in the known universe. The human brain is the lowest entropy place we know…
I’d like your comment more if it said: “I’d be glad if NATO didn’t have to exist”
I would much prefer every country in the planet being in NATO.
Any country attacks any other country? Literally the whole world goes to defend it. So no invasions are possible.
It wouldn’t work though. Wouldn’t take much time for alliances to form that agree to not follow NATO’S rules.
Nato already does not enforce their mission against the US and US backed vassel states
Nato already does not enforce their mission against the US and US backed vassel states
When did the US invade a member of NATO, again?
Nah, I want war. I want the rest of the world to go to war with the US. They’ve got a Nazi problem. We beat the Nazis in 1945 and we might need to beat them again in 2045.
Boo fucking hoo, you were wrong and come crying here about “tankies”? You are the exact same, just on the opposite side of the political spectrum. Get some self awareness. NATO is a bunch of warmongers who managed to get Putin to do the greatest PR coup for them just as they were losing significance - and now they could be important because at this moment Russian regime is the greater evil. But instead they do fuck all in helping Ukraine to a decisive victor, proving again that those shitstains just want to prolongue the conflict to line the pockets of their buddies in the military industrial complex. Disgusting fucks, all of them!
It’s funny how NATO members continue to throw more and more money into the alliance like they’re about to be attacked tomorrow. Russia can’t even conquer a third of Ukraine, so they’re hardly going to be much of a threat to everyone else.
If NATO is indeed a defensive alliance and the deterrent works, then there’s no need to put so much money into it at the expense of domestic needs for each member state.
It’s a fantastic revenue stream for arms manufacturers who can keep getting fat contracts to make more equipment. The day the war ends it will be a disaster for them.
That is indeed the way it appears that the west is viewing this conflict. A great way to make extort a lot of money from taxpayers for “not enough to live but too much to die” support for Ukraine, and it’s perverse that the powers that be don’t even blink at sacrificing the lives of tens of thousands of Ukrainians for that.
And come to think of it - a shorter conflict would also mean less Russian lives lost.
Capitalism is murderous. :(
Comment more, comment harder.
The world rejoices when troglodytes like yourself get outted and labelled.
Can you guess which tags I have over your username?
NATO is a bunch of warmongers who managed to get Putin to do the greatest PR coup for them
Lmao. I refuse to believe that any sane, adult person can hold this opinion. Nobody’s THAT fucking stupid, right?
Figures, consent doesn’t seem like something that both you and the Russians understand.
How weak is your position if the only “argument” you have is pretending to quote something that you invented yourself?
