Also, what is the evidence that the War in Donbass was an act of genocide on the part of Ukraine, and that Ukraine had provoked Russia? Once again, I am asking in good faith, I am merely looking for the truth.

16 points

Personally I (critically) support Russia, plain and simple. Others have gone into the details anyone with sense understands, so I won’t expand on them (other than noting my opinion is Russia was not belligerent, and has not been imperialist since the fall of the Tsars, nor colonialist in any sense of the word remotely comparable to that of the Zionist entity or Anglo settler-regimes).

Russia has its problems, and Putin is still a lib (albeit one who is, perhaps, on a path to something somewhat resembling recovery, minus the social conservatism which while unjustified is a pretty common reaction across the global south to western pinkwashed imperialism).

But I see supporting Russia in its resistance against imperialism- against its ethnic kin being genocided (the only reason there’s any debate to be had over it is due to Russian support preventing the worst of it, though they have still been subject, undeniably, of attempts at cultural genocide, countless war crimes, and what can only be described as pogroms), and it itself carved up and returned to the days of shock therapy, I see supporting Russia’s struggle against the west as such as merely a matter of basic decency.

After all, wouldn’t we support Iran, Yemen, or Afghanistan in their similar struggles? Or even India, flawed and debatably descending into fascism as it is? Looking back in hindsight also, it would only be natural to support the Ethiopians (even if it was the monarchy) in their struggle against the Italians, or the human-sacrificing Aztecs and Maya in their struggle against the Spanish, or the Qing in their struggles against the various western and Japanese imperialists, or even the Japanese in their initial struggles to resist and throw off the yoke of unequal treaties (before they joined the ranks of the imperialists themselves).

Anti-imperialism is simply a matter of basic decency, and recognizing that Russia’s struggle in this case is anti-imperialist in every sense of the word is a matter of common sense (sadly not common enough).

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some of the things that i want to say here will not differentiate from the other comments in this thread, though as a russian citizen and cprf member i hope that it will offer some insight for western readers.

i do not support the current administrations internal actions, as capitalism has brought nothing but injustice, suffering, poverty, crime and corruption. but i absolutely do support its foreign policy, especially regarding the ukrainian question. the putin government has evolved to become one of the most effective anti-imperialist forces on the planet and even if you ignore the terrible nature of the terrorist zelensky-regime one has to be grateful to our military for fighting the biggest enemy of mankind, america.

so lets detail the happenings that led to the current situation:

(it may be important to note that the current russian administration pushes a slightly different narrative due to sadly being a right wing state)

banderite collaborators parading in front of nazi officers

  • the banderites (see picture), members of the fascist “organization of ukrainian nationalists” led by stepan andreyevich bandera were a gang of rapists and murderers who collaborated with the invading german hordes and assisted them by conducting acts of terror against civilians. It is important to note that popular support for them was close to zero.
  • after the victory of the heroic red army, the majority of those parasites fled to the west, predominantly to canada. they received funding from american and british intelligence agencies, which were more than happy to welcome “former” nazis into their own anti-communist ranks.
  • another subset of the banderites remained in the ukrainian ssr and conducted a campaign of terror and sabotage against the civilian population. their bloody deeds were supported by the cia and its european puppet agencies through the so called “operation aerodynamic”.

referendum on the preservation of the ussr. its results were ignored by the anti-communists

  • After the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the ussr, the leaders of those fascist gangs were glorified by the ukrainian far-right, with support from the cia. efforts to further their “rehabilitation” were primarily directed by nazi expatriates in canada. outlets such as voice of america portrayed them as “heroes”.

results of the 2004 presidential election before cia intervention. this division between neonazi northwest and pro-russian southeast is visible to this day

  • in 2004, the west sabotaged the ukrainian presidential elections and installed their puppet, viktor andreyevich yushchenko, through a color revolution. he was a terrible leader, not only dismantling the remaining aspects of the ukrainian economy and managing to make life even more miserable than it already was, but also granting “hero of ukraine” status to banderite leaders and holocaust perpetrators stepan bandera and roman iosifovich shukhevich.
ukrainian neonazis in 2014

  • in 2014, america and the west orchestrated another coup, this time not even bothering to hide the involvement of neo-nazis. the new regime perpetrated unspeakable atrocities against the russian population, whom it consideres “subhuman,” as well as against ukrainian anti-fascists. in odessa alone, 39 people were burned alive in the local trade union building.
  • those developments led to the revolution in the predominantly russian populated donbass-area and the creation off the donetsk and lugansk peoples republics, as well as the referendum in crimea that led to the peninsula finally rejoining russia. from 2014 till 2022 the majority of humanitarian aid to the donbass republics came from the cprf.
  • the reason for the smo is the ukrainian western-aligned nazi regime violating the minsk accords by refusing to demilitarize, trying to join the fascist nato-block and murdering russian civilians for years on end. the russian government showed itself extremely lenient, to lenient even, as any sensible politician would have staged a military intervention much earlier. if you need further proof for the tyrannical nature of the kievan regime just look at the fact that zelenskiy has banned all opposition parties in his country, refuses to hold elections and effectively rules as a military dictator. furthermore he has outlawed the russian language, made any negotiation with the russian state illegal and is currently selling whatever is left of his country to the highest bidder.

combine all this with the fact that the west and its puppets need to always be opposed due to them being a cancer of humanity and youll get a pretty good picture of why to support the russian military.

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8 points

Excellent post

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thank you

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11 points

Excellent post, thanks for this writeup.

I’d also like to add this article, fully refuting the “Russia is imperialist” myth.

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thanks, i might do a post debunking russophobic propaganda sometime later

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30 points

I would never call what I am doing “support” for the Russian federation. Pointing out basic facts and chronology isn’t “support”.

And I don’t think it is relevant to even talk about this or that power being a “lesser evil”. The russian leadership’s reaction to the events from the 1990s to today have been entirely predictable. The events which led up to this war.

Far from being a cunning schemer looking to revive the Russian empire, Putin is closer to being a cornered rat (and he is a rat) who is forced to make a desperate move at the last minute when all else failed (repeated warning against nato expansion, the failures of the Minsk agreements, warning against Ukrainian militaristisation, trying peace talks which failed again and again, etc).

In fact, Putin is exactly the kind of idealistic Russian liberal that westerners wish would overthrow Putin. He thought that cozying up to the west (he even tried joining nato in the past) and selling his people to them would keep the west placated (and earn the Russian bourgeoise a seat at the table). It took him far too long to realise that the western leadership is not interested whatsoever in peace or equality.

The situation is actually kind of similar as the one in Israel. An entity with a history of belligerence and colonisation gets attacked. Liberals are unable to conceive of historical context and think that the immediate aggressors are some kind of super voldemort evil.

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12 points

It took him far too long to realise that the western leadership is not interested whatsoever in peace or equality.

I’m not even sure he has fully realized it though.

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5 points

Maybe, but there are better options now.

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13 points

Eh, I think by this point he gets it. I would be surprised if he didn’t get it after Boris sabotaged the peace talks, or especially after kursk.

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-16 points
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you shouldn’t.
there are many people who call themselves marxist-leninists on this site who do not subscribe to anything marx or lenin had to say about inter-imperialist conflict.
communists and marxists and leninists always seek peace above all else.
the only war worth fighting is class war and the inter-imperialist rivalry won’t benefit the working class.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/feb/08.htm

as a bonus, this speech is particularly prophetic. lenin calls calls out basically the next 100 years of US foreign policy in 1917.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/may/14.htm

the only thing the people who call ourselves marxists leninists should be hoping for is a quick peace, a lasting peace, and a humiliating peace for both sides so that the army mutinies and makes proletarian seizure of state power possible (like happened in russia, angola, mozambique, etc.)

even tho virtue signalling is what most people here support, they have decided to support the russian government who made domestic abuse entirely legal and who criminalize queer identities freely expressing. condemning russia’s government is not endorsing ukraine’s.

EDIT: this entire site is filled with ultras, third-worldists, and campists whose beliefs amount to little more than “america bad” but framed in whatever quotations of leftist thinkers they need to justify themselves. read for yourself, think for yourself, and above all just get organized instead of treating politics like religious salvation and orthodoxy like so many people do.

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9 points
9 points

this entire site is filled with ultras, third-worldists, and campists

[Citations needed]

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0 points
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i have a source now if you are genuinely curious.

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10 points

EDIT: this entire site is filled with ultras, third-worldists, and campists whose beliefs amount to little more than “america bad” but framed in whatever quotations of leftist thinkers they need to justify themselves. read for yourself, think for yourself, and above all just get organized instead of treating politics like religious salvation and orthodoxy like so many people do.

How about addressing the content of what is being said instead of doubling down on bad faith nonsense. From what I can gather, usually the term ultra is used to refer to people who expect purity out of socialism, rather than contending with conditions as they are. So not sure how you get that out of numerous people in this thread saying varying statements along the lines of that support for Russian leadership is a tenuous thing to have at best, relative to its resistance to imperialism, while you are saying no one should have any support for them. 🫠

And how do you arrive at such a liberal reddit-brain-sounding analysis as “people believe little more than ‘america bad’”? The western empire refers to more than the US, but the US is the power center of it at this point in history and has been for a while now. Please stop projecting your own reductionist thinking onto others because people disagreed with your views on Russia and Ukraine. I mean, for god’s sake, you accuse others of using quotations as justifications for those views like this is inherently a failing, but you did just that in this very post and when challenged on how the term you used applies to this situation, it appears you ignored it with an edit, doubling down with an even more ridiculous and nasty framing about the entire website.

I’m genuinely confused as to where this extreme rejection of everyone is coming from, as you otherwise seem to want to be here and otherwise appear to share similar views as others here have.

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24 points

Please explain how contemporary Russia is imperialist.

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23 points

there are many people who call themselves marxist-leninists on this site who do not subscribe to anything marx or lenin had to say about inter-imperialist conflict.

This is a bad faith way to start your post on this and also doesn’t make sense in this context. Russia isn’t imperialist, so how is it inter-imperialist rivalry? Some reasoning on why Russia is not imperialist found here: https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Imperialism#Russian_“imperialism”

It is possible we’re reading different posts, but in my time here, how I see Russia talked about is with the term “critical support” if support is given at all; meaning that (roughly speaking) the person supports them with regard to resisting the western empire, but does not support anything else about its leadership, necessarily. Russia and the US are far from equal powers dueling for hegemony, as a framing like “inter-imperialist conflict” might suggest, and it is not helpful to understanding imperialism or global conflict to reduce something to “both sides” simply because neither government is socialist.

IIRC, Mao goes into the concept in On Contradiction, of varying allying conditions with the Kuomintang and how that relationship evolved. I think it’s a decent analog to what we’re talking about here. Imperialism is the prevailing force of global power, not local reactionaries, and so some amount of allowance for that needs to be made in considering who is and isn’t worth “supporting”: https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_17.htm

And modern day China seems to understand this and utilizes it to further an alternative to the western imperialist order. If they were only willing to have ties with those states who are controlled by a communist vanguard party, they’d have limited allies on the global stage, which would make it easier for the empire to isolate them, undermine them, etc.

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21 points

If China had been the “good” communist and stopped commodity production and only allied with communist parties and sent them money every year so they could develop they would still live in the 1970s, but this poverty ultras would call an example of socialism.

Unrelated to the comment chain lol I just wanted to add that in.

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-3 points
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is this a response to me?
i’m a bit confused.
i don’t know what the CPC have to do with the question of whether people on the internet should say they like Russia or Ukraine in a war.

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