Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse::px-captcha
Nah, bro. We need wider streets and more cars. That will surely reduce traffic.
Actually good trains and bus systems, actually good bike infrastructure, mixed use spaces that allow people to walk to stuff.
You forgot the single biggest factor: quit mandating low density. In order for walkability to happen, more trip origins and destinations need to be closer together.
Seems like they thought that ride-sharing an Uber would reduce traffic, but the cheaper prices just ended up with more people using ride-hailing services instead of public transport.
Full article text: ##Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse ###Our research at MIT helped make the case for ride-sharing. We were wrong. We don’t want to make the same mistake with robotaxis Carlo Ratti, John Rossant Sep. 16, 2023
A rush of feet, a cone, and screech! The pinnacle of human technological prowess grinds to a halt.
Activists in San Francisco have discovered that they can immobilize robotaxis with nothing more than a simple orange traffic cone.
This attention-grabbing, legally ambiguous stunt has succeeded in showcasing the limits of autonomous vehicle technology. But it may ultimately miss the bigger picture.
The real threat from robotaxis is the underlying technology. Once these cars inevitably learn to get around the traffic cones and gain the public’s trust, their convenience could seduce us into vastly overusing our cars.
The result? An artificial-intelligence-powered nightmare of traffic, technically perfect but awful for our cities.
Why do we believe this? Because it has already come to pass with ride-sharing.
In the 2010s, the Senseable City Lab at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, where one of us serves as the director, was at the forefront of using Big Data to study how ride-hailing and ride-sharing could make our streets cleaner and more efficient. The findings appeared to be astonishing: With minimal delays to passengers, we could match riders and reduce the size of New York City taxi fleets by 40%. More people could get around in fewer cars for less money. We could reduce car ownership, and free up curbs and parking lots for new uses.
This utopian vision was not only compelling but within reach. After publishing our results, we started the first collaboration between MIT and Uber to research a then-new product: Uber Pool (now rebranded UberX Share), a service that allows riders to share cars when heading to similar destinations for a lower cost.
Alas, there is no such thing as a free lunch.
Our research was technically right, but we had not taken into account changes in human behavior. Cars are more convenient and comfortable than walking, buses and subways — and that is why they are so popular. Make them even cheaper through ride-sharing and people are coaxed away from those other forms of transit.
This dynamic became clear in the data a few years later: On average, ride-hailing trips generated far more traffic and 69% more carbon dioxide than the trips they displaced.
We were proud of our contribution to ride-sharing but dismayed to see the results of a 2018 study that found that Uber Pool was so cheap it increased overall city travel: For every mile of personal driving it removed, it added 2.6 miles of people who otherwise would have taken another mode of transportation.
As robotaxis are on the cusp of proliferating across the world, we are about to repeat the same mistake, but at a far greater scale. The futuristic allure of autonomy — and the enormous profits it could generate for its creators — will be hard for governments and the public to resist. But we cannot let a shiny new piece of technology drive us into an epic traffic jam of our own making.
The best way to make urban mobility accessible, efficient and green is not about new technologies — neither self-driving cars nor electric ones — but old ones. Buses, subways, bikes and our own two feet are cleaner, cheaper and more efficient than anything Silicon Valley has dreamt up.
What’s the Cadillac of reducing our dependence on Cadillacs? The good old-fashioned bus.
This is not to say self-driving technology has no role in the future, just a different (and perhaps a bit less lucrative) one than GM-backed Cruise and Alphabet-backed Waymo seem to be currently focused on.
Autonomous technology could, for example, allow cities to offer more buses, shuttles and other forms of public transit around the clock. That’s because the availability of on-demand AVs could assure “last-mile” connections between homes and transit stops. It could also be a godsend for older people and those with disabilities. However, any scale-up of AVs should be counterbalanced with investments in mass transit and improvements in walkability. Above all, we must put in place smart regulatory and tax regimes that allow all sustainable mobility modes — including autonomous services — to scale safely and intelligently. They should include, for example, congestion fees to discourage overuse of individual vehicles.
To get new technologies right, our cities might follow the example of Singapore. Thanks to its Smart Nation program, the Asian city is now at the forefront of experimentation with autonomy. Yet, like San Francisco, it has experienced hiccups with its self-driving car pilot programs; young people have taken to confusing the vehicles by throwing balls or, more boldly, getting in front of them and dancing. The first reaction of the government, unamused, was to mull a law banning the harassment of self-driving cars.
However, unlike San Francisco, Singapore has little to worry about in the long run because it already has robust systems to control traffic — a highly efficient mass transit network and a system of Electronic Road Pricing that dynamically taxes cars to prevent congestion.
These types of measures are easier said than done. To pass even one such efficient, top-down measure in an American city would be no small feat. But this is still a gold standard we should strive to emulate.
The allure of the self-driving car is that it will liberate us: from thought, from action, from responsibility. But that is not how new technology, from the wheel to the internet, has ever worked. By unlocking new possibilities, technological progress forces us to make new, difficult choices about how to manage it. The next few years will be crucial; we all need to be alert to the unintended consequences of this technology.
Self-driving cars are coming, but it is all of us who need to take the wheel.
Carlo Ratti is a practicing architect and a professor at MIT, where he directs the Senseable City Lab. He is a co-author of “Atlas of the Senseable City.” John Rossant is founder and CEO of CoMotion, a conference and media platform focused on future mobility.
The correct way to fix traffic is public transportation: railways and subways.
The correct way to fix traffic is to stop designing the world around cars to the exclusion of absolutely everything the fuck else including humans.
…including working on security measures to ensure that people feel safe using them
Definitely needs to be solved where it exists, but there are many places in the world that don’t have this problem.
Fair, but where I am it certainly is an argument I hear from many people - particularly women - that refuse to use public transport alone, particularly at night. There’s only so many reports you can read about people being groped, sexually harassed or hurt, see the security being buddies with the loudest and rowdiest pack of gangsters in the section and look a female friend in the eye as they recount someone whipping our their wiener in front of them, then walking away like nothing happened. Eventually, “that won’t happen to me” turns into “shit, it just might”.
This may be an issue of selection bias, but downplaying it does the progress of public transport a disservice - infrastructural improvements need to go hand in hand with service improvements, if we want them to become a viable alternative.
Oh, by the way, this is a big city in southern Germany. We’re not even the worst place.
Self-driving callable buses might not be a horrible thing. You open up an app that says I need a ride It tells you where within a mile to walk and send something on its way to drop by and pick you up.
How the fuck was Uber supposed to help traffic? That’s the most American take on solving traffic issues I’ve read in a while.
In theory it just reduced parked cars. If 100 people need to go somewhere at the same time, you still need 100 ubers to do it.
Uber pool would actually reduce cars in circulation but for some reason americans can’t share rides and even then buses are just a better way to do it.
The actual study modeled a 40% reduction in number of taxis on the road when hailing was made more efficient, with carpooling passengers, and a re-purposing of parking space:
In the 2010s, the Senseable City Lab at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, where one of us serves as the director, was at the forefront of using Big Data to study how ride-hailing and ride-sharing could make our streets cleaner and more efficient. The findings appeared to be astonishing: With minimal delays to passengers, we could match riders and reduce the size of New York City taxi fleets by 40%. More people could get around in fewer cars for less money. We could reduce car ownership, and free up curbs and parking lots for new uses.
But it turns out that just like with widening highways, human behavior responds to the increased efficiency by stepping up the demand to reach the previous equilibrium again.
I imagine that the fact that you call cars with an app instead of waiting for an empty taxi to pass by is more efficient, and you can have less cars for the same number of passengers. Basically having less empty taxis on the road.
I know it’s a stretch, but this is the only way I can see Uber reducing traffic.
You used to call taxis to pick you up not just wait for one to randomly pass LMAO, that was solved by cellphones. Individual Uber drives do not solve anything, it is still one car to take one person somewhere, it does reduce parked cars tho. Uber pool did help alleviate traffic but its hard for americans to share rides for some stupid reason, and even then a bus would be more efficient.
I’ve never heard this argument. I’ve heard car share apps could reduce parking issues but how traffic? It’s still a car that can hold generally 4, same as anyone has
Uber does have a carpool option. But I’m not sure how often it gets used.
I don’t understand how anyone ever thought they could reduce traffic. Even if they only served people who would otherwise have driven, a cab replacing an A to B and a C to D journey has to do three journeys to replace those two (A to B, B to C, and C to D). It was always going to increase traffic.
The text of the article explains that it’s based on reducing the number of taxis (or cars for hire generally) on the road, reducing parking spots, and increasing carpooling:
In the 2010s, the Senseable City Lab at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, where one of us serves as the director, was at the forefront of using Big Data to study how ride-hailing and ride-sharing could make our streets cleaner and more efficient. The findings appeared to be astonishing: With minimal delays to passengers, we could match riders and reduce the size of New York City taxi fleets by 40%. More people could get around in fewer cars for less money. We could reduce car ownership, and free up curbs and parking lots for new uses.
This utopian vision was not only compelling but within reach. After publishing our results, we started the first collaboration between MIT and Uber to research a then-new product: Uber Pool (now rebranded UberX Share), a service that allows riders to share cars when heading to similar destinations for a lower cost.
It goes on to explain that it’s a problem of induced demand (same phenomenon that causes highway expansion not to actually help with congestion in the long term):
Alas, there is no such thing as a free lunch.
Our research was technically right, but we had not taken into account changes in human behavior. Cars are more convenient and comfortable than walking, buses and subways — and that is why they are so popular. Make them even cheaper through ride-sharing and people are coaxed away from those other forms of transit.
This dynamic became clear in the data a few years later: On average, ride-hailing trips generated far more traffic and 69% more carbon dioxide than the trips they displaced.
We were proud of our contribution to ride-sharing but dismayed to see the results of a 2018 study that found that Uber Pool was so cheap it increased overall city travel: For every mile of personal driving it removed, it added 2.6 miles of people who otherwise would have taken another mode of transportation.
Again, I’ve never heard this popularized.
I understand the concepts surfaced
Idea is that instead of 4 cars containing 1 person in each of them you get 1 car with 4 people in it. No idea how well it works in practice though, I assume most people who already drive will want to keep driving alone even if it is more expensive.
The way I see them get used, the driver is never going anywhere themselves, they’re just working as a taxi. I’ve never seen Uber reduce the number of cars required, but I have been in situations where we needed to call 2 Ubers when everyone would have fit if the driver’s seat was available.
If that’s the primary use case then it indeed does not help anyone. Have never used it so I assumed passengers use it to get a lift when going to work or some event like concert by someone who would travel there anyway.
You’ve never heard about capitalism? Zero labor cost means it’s cheaper to have 100 taxis in your fleet when you would normally have 10.
If anything, I see it becoming the board game Othello to a degree, the big companies flood every inch of road with their cars instead of the other guys. I’d even see them using groups of their robo cars to create intentional traffic for their competitors, only to then communicate back to their own fleet where the only viable route through town is. This way it’s like a tooth eat and if you want to get across town, you know it will take you 15 mins with Y brand and an hour plus with A brand.
Wake up and smell the death march called endless corporate growth.
It’s almost like we need to prioritize a better form of interconnected transportation that’s more efficient at moving larger amounts of people with a small foot print.
To clarify, it does not have to be a bus, but it can be a tram, train, subway, elevated rail, cable car, bike, scooter.
It’s almost like people don’t enjoy sharing rides with crackheads that don’t really reach their destination…
It’s almost like a lack of investment and propoganda from car companies have convinced people public transportation can’t be convenient, clean, and reliable.
As someone who rides public transportation every day that I’m not allowed to work from home, it’s not convenient or clean and the only reliable thing about the MTA is that there will be “unavoidable delays”
Investing won’t change the fact that personal cars are a superior form or transport for the majority of people for the majority of the time.
The cat is out of the bag and it’s never going in again.
Put more money into the public transit system instead of a private company that shafts both paying customers and their employees and maybe those problems could be taken care of. Maybe even invest in some sort of program to help people who are homeless, and/or addicted to drugs and alcohol to get them off the street.
As valid you point is, it also holds true for taking a Uber Pool or Robo taxi where a drunk or crackhead decided to jump in and join you, or you them.
The only difference being if it happens on a Uber Pool ride you don’t have the option of “jumping on the next one” without forking over a sum of money or canceling your trip.
Not to mention at the same time you are stuck in the same congestion caused by a inefficient (though comfortable?) mode of transportation.
