I’ve been helping my 72 year old bilingual (Spanish) mother come to terms with one of her nieces having transitioned.
She’s been remarkably progressive about it, but she did bring up some good questions that I didn’t have answers for.
(I have my own set of annoyances for pronouns in English. Using a third person plural for single individuals has been leading to confusion, especially amongst my English L2 friends and family. But pronouns are some of the most conservative parts of speech in any language so I’m not going to tilt at that particular windmill. )
As a question for my LGBTQ+ kith, what have you been seeing/using as pronouns in different languages? Romantic languages are generally still heavily gendered, as are some Germanic. Does that interfere with non-binary language patterns? What about Turkish, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese, Arabic, etc?
Have there been any instances of novel pronouns created?
And, not to pry open old wounds, but has anybody noticed new slurs or other intentionally hurtful epithets?
The first question is an effort to answer questions that I hadn’t even thought to ask. I’m actually pretty proud of the older generation making an effort to live in the modern world.
The rest is pure personal curiosity and possible conversation material.
Huge thank you to everybody taking time out of their day to answer.
It’s complicated in German. Almost every noun being gendered brings up a bunch of issues unknown to the English speaking world, long before we get to the topic of non-binary folks.
Just imagine every job description, occupation and whatnot being gendered, with male being the default. In English this is rare nowadays, in German it’s baked into the language. A doctor and a doctoress, a maypr and a mayoress, a student and a studentess, a cyclist and a cyclistess.
The feminist movement has been trying to find solutions for this for decades, they are fairly controversial among older conservative folks, and admittedly inelegant.
Concerning non-binary folks it gets even more complicated. Not only does referring to almost any description automatically infer a binary gender, we also don’t have any option for unspecified pronouns other than “it”, which is hugely dehumanizing. The equivalent of “they” is already used as a honorific.
Some people tried introducing neopronouns but they never took off. Most enbies I know simply chose the binary pronoun they are the least uncomfortable with and stick with that.
In the US press, there was some coverage of the sier/xier body of neo pronouns for enby people. Are those the ones you mention that didn’t catch on?
In Dutch there’s hen/hun and die/diens as relatively common gender neutral pronouns, but they’re not very well known. I once had a (English speaking) non-binary TA and my (Dutch) teammate and I ended up using English when discussing them because we didn’t know how to use gender neutral pronouns in dutch
For Spanish, contrary to what conservatives say, the “white liberals in California” did not invent what we call inclusive language/pronouns. The @ and the X were being used by people like me some 20 years ago, within Latin American communities.
Yeah, it’s really infuriating seeing people act like this stuff is new. I grew up in south america, a couple of blocks from a state Faculty of Psychology, the student body was like 80% female and there was a strong presence of feminist advocacy groups (regular marches, public events, ever-present banners and posters, etc). I remember reading signs using “TOD@S” or “TODXS” decades ago.
I’m not a native speaker, but I’ve studied Japanese for more than a decade. There are no singular, non-gendered third person pronouns, so there is no equivalent of a singular they. Although there is an equivalent of a plural they, it’s not completely gender neutral. The equivalent of him is kare, and the equivalent of her is kanojo. You can make them plural by ending “ra” on to the end of them. Kanojora is used only for groups of women/girls, and karera can be used for a group of men/boys, or a mixed-gender group. That makes the root meaning of karera male coded even if it’s used in a gender neutral manner, so non-binary people might prefer not to use that.
This shouldn’t however be a major issue for Japanese speakers, as first person pronouns are the only ones that are in frequent use. Unlike English, where you use pronouns to avoid repitition, you can completely omit them in Japanese, so instead of asking “Has Asami done her homework?” in English, you would ask “Has Asami done homework?” It’s also preferable to use names instead of 2nd/3rd person pronouns. Instead of asking “How about you?”, you’d ask “How about (person’s name)?” It’s probably much easier for a non-binary person to ask that no pronouns be used for them
As you say, in casual conversation, the subject is often implied after its introduction. So after asking “How is Tomoko?” if you say, “Got yelled at by the boss again?”, your listener would know that you would be asking about Tomoko’s situation, without saying she get yelled at. In English it tends to default to you or I.
I can sort of speak on Vietnamese but I’m not exactly fluent. Vietnamese pronouns are mostly gendered, and there is an additional dimension of the relative age/relationship and politeness between you and the other person when choosing which pronoun to use. Can also vary with dialect but I can’t say much on that.
There’s “tôi” for first-person and “bạn” for second person which are gender neutral but are more formal, there’s also “mình” (1st person). However for example, if you’re a young adult man you might refer to another person as “anh/chị” (literally also means older brother/older sister) if they are a man or woman slightly older than you which is usually the safe bet if with similar ages. If they could be your parents, “chú” or “cô” - also “bác” for both. If they could be grandparents, “ông” or “bà” and you refer to yourself as “cháu/con” for both. Conversely, someone younger you may refer to as “em” (gender-neutral) or “cháu/con” (gender-neutral) and you would refer to yourself as “anh/chú/ông” (male) depending on the degree of generation difference. In a hetero-romantic relationship, the guy is referred to and refers himself as “anh” while the girl “em” regardless of relative age?
I’m not sure about the queer young generation in Vietnam would use these days. For overseas Vietnamese-Americans, I have heard of “chanh” to address non-binary people which is a mix of “chị + anh” from both binary gender pronouns. There’s also “cam” since “chanh” can also refer to a lemon lol, and “cam” means orange which is a parallel that seems less binary. “Nó” is sort of an equivalent to “it” pronoun but there’s nuance to that. “Tao” and “mày” are also gender-neutral but very informal and derogatory lol
