A career State Department official resigned from her post on Tuesday, saying she could no longer work for the Biden administration after it released a report concluding that Israel was not preventing the flow of aid to Gaza.
Stacy Gilbert, who served as a senior civilian-military advisor to the State Department’s Bureau of Population, Refugees and Migration (PRM), sent an email to staff saying she was resigning because she felt the State Department had made the wrong assessment, The Washington Post reported, citing officials who read the note.
The report was filed in response to President Joe Biden issuing a national security memorandum (NSM-20) in early February on whether the administration finds credible Israel’s assurances that its use of US weapons do not violate either American or international law.
The report said there were reasonable grounds to believe Israel on several occasions had used American-supplied weapons “inconsistent” with international humanitarian law, but said it could not make a definitive assessment - enough to prevent the suspension of arms transfers.
When the genocide is this obvious, and the ongoing consequences for the democrats and democracy this serious, it really makes me wonder what’s the political calculus behind it.
Is AIPAC really that big of a threat? Is netanyahu that important to our imperial interests in the middle east? Why choose full on putinesque post-truth politics over this?
I’ve never had much faith in the democrats, but I honestly just don’t understand what’s driving such terrible decision making.
Pulling support from Isreal isn’t nearly as popular as someone who is in the progressive / lemmy bubble would think. And besides public opinion, Isreal has a very strong lobby. Also, while there are more vocal American Jews standing against Isreal now, they’re far from united against Isreal.
I know it seems like it’s a clear win because of the echo chamber in here, but it could cost them not only the presidential election, but down ballot as well, if they go against Isreal. And I’ve said it before, chasing the Leftist vote is an exercise in futility. They will just move goalposts, and you may very well lose more voters appeasing them than you gain. And the votes you do gain will be fickle.
It sucks to say, but their strategy is solid. And we need to celebrate the small wins to encourage their slow break from unconditional support.
Edit:
Lemmy as a whole - “Political polls are very unreliable and next to useless”
ITT: “A specific poll agrees with my opinion, and thus should be treated as the absolute truth”
Uh huh. Re: echo chambers
I’ve seen a number of polls that reiterate how strongly youth and democrats oppose israel’s actions and call it genocide. I don’t think it’s an echo chamber effect.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx
This poll from March shows 55/36 disapprove/approve.
Moreover, democrats disapprove at 75% vs 18% approve and independents disapprove at 60% to 29% approve. Sure, republicans approve at 64%, but ain’t no republicans switching to biden over gaza.
Those numbers are brutal for democrats, and getting worse. More obvious genocide from the israelis and feeble lies from biden isn’t going to reverse that trend.
It’s easy to say disapprove, you should look at the rankings of what issues are on their minds. Gaza is down there.
Completely Pulling support is one thing, but “conditioning support” has broad bipartisan public appeal. Bernie Sanders can articulate this well; support for Israeli defense programs like Iron Dome, and cutting support for offensive artillery that’s being used to storm Gaza. Why can’t Biden say the same, instead he’s trying to split hairs on whether tanks into Rafah doesn’t count as a ground invasion (and making himself look stupid in front of voters).
So solid that polling says the opposite, the media is starting to catch on, and there is a report that dem strategists are freaking the fuck out over how shit Biden’s chances are. CNN miraculously figured out that, surprise surprise a lot of it has to do with Biden’s handling of Gaza.
Sry, but you’re delusional if you seriously think that the Israel thing isn’t a huge factor towards why Biden has lost so much support. We are literally seeing a democratic president aid Israel in commiting a genocide.
Outside of lemmy I get tons of information about the ongoing genocide. As far as I can tell, the democratic strategy is not solid. They’re going be in for a rough realization that Trump stands a very good chance of becoming the next president. But I suppose we just have to wait and see, I wouldn’t count on Biden winning, and neither our NATO allies as they’re Trump proofing themselves.
This is only half the story: the US consciously chooses how they put out information about these issues, it’s not as if the american public just magically stays ignorant to the facts on the ground. The state department has repeatedly denied Israeli atrocities and culpability, and even in the instances where israel’s actions are black and white (like the above report), they speak about them them as if they are less concrete than they clearly are.
I think a lot of people are kidding themselves if they think there’s no material benefit to the US by keeping Israel as an iron-clad ally in the middle east. I think it’s crazy that anyone would even need to articulate the reasons why the middle east is so significant to modern geopolitics; the significance of the region’s natural resources and distribution thereof simply can’t be overstated. Look back just a couple years to the news around Nord Stream and russian sanctions to get an idea about what oil means to the world economy.
The polls are kinda irrelevant to the issue: public opinion follows state messaging (at least the portion you’re describing that supports israel blindly), and even where it deviates in this case (allegedly), I think most people might recognize the need for intervention if the state department just passed along the reports happening on the ground and not obfuscate israel’s roll here.
The US is at least partially responsible for their own propagandizing here.
I think a lot of people are kidding themselves if they think there’s no material benefit to the US by keeping Israel as an iron-clad ally in the Middle East
Not at all. Israel is a greater liability than any benefit they provide. Unconditional support for every Israeli aggression makes the US deeply unpopular in the rest of the region when we were previously popular. It undermines all our rhetoric of freedom and human rights when we partner with such a blatant violator of them. Bin Laden spelled out in his 2001 statement that support for Israel’s atrocities is what motivated 9/11, and doubling down on that support only increased terrorism for the next 20 years.
And what do we get out of this ironclad support? Did Israel help us in any of our wars in Iraq or Afghanistan? Do they give us any aid or resources or do they demand them from us?
I honestly don’t think there is any calculus happening here. Biden is a Zionist. It’s not outlandish to think there are other high ranking Democrats who are also Zionists enabling him. They might be upset at the optics, but they’re not upset at the outcome. The Biden administration also doesn’t seem to think this position will cost them the election, so they see no incentive to pause their goals.
They figure that they would lose more votes from people who support Israel than they’re currently losing from people who support Palestine so much they would rather have Trump in power (in which case Palestine will be in even more trouble, which isn’t a problem for Israel supporters).
but I honestly just don’t understand what’s driving such terrible decision making.
I mean, look around these comments sections and see the apologism. If you bring up any criticism of Biden, you must support Trump! Its 2016 all over again, where voters with legitimate concerns about the candidate are being told to basically stfu. Democrats of a certain vintage think they are owed your vote.
Yeah, and imagine where we’d be today if people had just sucked it up and voted for Hillary in 2016. Just the SCOTUS alone.
But sure, it’s the fault of the people warning you how bad it would be to let Trump win, because they couldn’t make voting for Hillary feel good.
if people had just sucked it up
If ifs and buts were candy and nuts…
You have to come to terms with the material fact that this approach to electoralism doesn’t work. Shaming votings, telling them you know better, that they owe you their vote, that Trump is way worse so they should vote for someone they dont want: Its been demonstrated to be ineffective at winning elections.
You can and maybe should be disappointment in the electorate for this being the case, but you can’t be in denial of it if you actually want to beat Trump. You have to do something different and convince them that the candidate is worth voting for. Or rather, the candidate needs to convince the electorate they are worth voting for. They need to go out and build a coalition. Candidates need to go to where voters are, hear their issues and concerns, and address them with their platform.
Trump is doing that. Maybe he gets booed. He got booed at the libertarian conference last weekend I think. But he’s showing up to where voters are, and attempting to convince them that he’s the answer for the issues they face. Democrats could take a hint.
Here’s the political calculus for Democrats:
This appears to be a very unusual election. Normally Democrats lead with young voters, and Republicans lead with older voters. But this year, Biden has gained ground with older voters even while losing ground with young voters.
So the first thing to consider is that Biden is trying harder to appeal to older voters than usual for Democrats, and older voters are more likely to support Israel.
Furthermore, older voters are much more likely to vote, which is good news for Biden. This also means that Biden has less reason to maximize turnout than previous Democrats.
The obvious question is why doesn’t Biden try to win over young and older voters? I’m sure he would like to, but supporting Palestine isn’t the way to do it. Surprisingly, young voters actually don’t care that much about Gaza. Furthermore, according to that article “young voters who wanted Biden to pressure Israel to stop attacking Gaza would vote for him at about the same rate as those who didn’t.” So supporting Palestine might just be downside risk with older voters.
Putting all this together, and the political calculus favors appealing to older voters on Israel, and trying to find some other issue to win back young voters.
I think it’s the same short sighted calculus businesses use. They aren’t thinking about the long term. They just want to win this election. And there’s a path to victory by grabbing soft conservatives. They don’t care that they’re obliterating our reputation, the reputation of our intelligence community (who press F to doubt on Israel’s claims), and the reputation of the party.
It can’t be worthwhile trying to fight over the pro-Israel lobby considering how hard the Republicans back Israel no matter what.
It basically only makes sense if corruption is involved. There’s no reasonable moral ground for enabling genocide.
States just aren’t moral entities - there’s no reasonable moral ground for most anything an imperial power does. It’s almost always just about securing more power.
But I don’t understand how this makes sense for the democrats from even a realpolitik perspective.
I said this only makes sense if states lack morals(corrupt).
You say “well states aren’t moral”.
How are these different enough that you felt the need to downvote me? I’m literally agreeing with you.
Biden is afraid of the same Israeli political action networks that evaded registering as foreign agents for about half a year before JFK and Bobby were assassinated. Those networks never came into compliance and split into a parent and a subsidiary. The parent organization has disbanded. The subsidiary is now known as AIPAC. If he pulls support from Likudnik Israel those terrorists will instantly put two bullets in the back of his head.
I personally don’t think that fear of assassination is what’s driving biden and the democrats policy on this.
Given that netanyahu and gvir were almost certainly involved in killing yitzhak rabin I’m sure they’re capable, I just think the risk/reward is off. They can affect US policy without the risks inherent in killing an allied head of state.
Biden, what the fuck are you doing!? Can you do the right thing when it comes to genocide, please? Just hand the election over to trump on a silver platter. How hard is it to… not support genocide? Wtf
The Democrat’s strategy to appeal to their base really seems to be, “Look, we’re not as bad at the other guys.” And they really aren’t realizing that that isn’t enough, because it’s not just about Israel/Palestine anymore. I really don’t think the people who are also repeating this party line (including the ones on Lemmy) are realizing how out of touch this sentiment is especially the younger Millennials/Gen Z.
I’ve seen my friends get attacked, arrested, and get criminal records from the university encampments and protests, and nothing was done to protect them. In their eyes, Trump would never protect them, but neither did Biden or any other Democrat in power. How can they be trusted to protect the people in the future? Seen from this lens, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to think that there might be people out there who find voting for Biden unpalatable.
I’ve been saying for a long time that Democrats basically sell themselves on the idea that you should be afraid that the Republican might win, and vote for them to prevent that. Sometimes they get something done, often only after compromising heavily, but for the most part that’s not the message they’re selling on.
To put it another way, if someone asks you why they should vote Dem instead of third party, the answer isn’t about how great the Dems are and why they deserve your vote it’s about why you should be scared that the GOP might win. It didn’t work in 2016 because most didn’t actually think Trump might win and it did in 2020 because they knew he could.
It might work this time (I’d give it better than even odds, even given the Israel/Gaza stuff is going to hurt Biden some), but eventually it won’t and when it fails and we get another GOP president the Dems won’t win another election for a while - either we immediately fall into Christo-fascist super-Nazism and there are no more elections where we could vote for Dems or we don’t and Dems are at a loss on what to do for votes.
Our current political structure and the two party system makes even the best politician look feeble.
I’m not sure how to do it but represent.us proposes to fix it in the near future (if we all bought in, I suppose).
One thing that sticks out on that sit is that whether all of voters agree or very few of us agree on a policy there’s about a 30% chance of the policy becoming law.
It goes without saying that the rich and corporations benefit from the current system. It will be tough to change. And makes our system pretty pathetic in practice.
Democrats basically sell themselves on the idea that you should be afraid that the Republican might win, and vote for them to prevent that.
Pathetically, that’s what Republicans said for the 4 years Trump was in office. “Please overlook his faults, a Democrat would be worse!”
You know when the ML’s say “scratch a liberal and …,” it’s that. That’s what you are seeing. Liberals will always defer to fascism in support of corporate interests.
What do ML’s say about the Khmer Rouge? Haven’t seen discussion of it myself, maybe you can provide me with a link?
If you pressure them long enough they admit they consider them justified genocides
Wtf did you think Biden is? Dark Brandon?
It’s his job to do US policy - ie, enabling Israel’s genocide, just like all the other mass-murder US policy is responsible for.
He is facing a lot of resistance amongst his electorate for doing his job - therefore he will be handing over to a regime that can perform this sacrosanct aspect of US policy without meeting any resistance from it’s electorate.
It’s “liberal democracy” working the way it’s supposed to in all it’s pseudo-democratic glory.
Everyone who votes for trump because they think he is better for Gaza than Biden really deserves Trump
Idk if anyone is saying they’ll vote for trump over Biden because they think he will be better for genocide or for people in the states.
Saying Biden and the Democrats are enabling genocide and watching it happen is not the same thing as saying “we will vote for trump”
It’s calling out people and hoping they do better.
But I guarantee you if Biden loses the election this November, all the pieces will be about why black and brown and Muslim voters didn’t come out, rather than examining why an absolutely massive proportion of white people vote for trump and the Republicans at every turn even though they’re destroying the country.
Oh they’ll blame all the demographics they can. The youths. “Progressives”. I doubt they’d go so far as to blame “wokeism” but I imagine some other made up demographic would apparate.
I mean I’m voting Biden in the fall, swing state and all. But still, The DNC needs a lot of overhaul for sure.
That isn’t really an effective strategy to convince someone to vote for someone else. That just pushes someone further entrenching them into their view.
If we want anyone and everyone left of center to vote for Biden even though he’s fucking up Gaza. We’re going to have to convince them. Having that type of attitude only hurts us in the long run.
I’d suggest picking other issues to discuss where the average progressive/leftie would agree with the direction of the Democrats, esp where a Trump win would likely mean a severe worsening. The right to bodily autonomy, LGBT+ rights, student loan forgiveness, progressive tax brackets (that may be a stretch for importance to the morally disaffected, but still), unions. Democrats may not be the best on those topics, but they at least move things a couple ticks in the right direction in the face of the alternative, which would be a very fast reversal of those gains (see recent supreme court rulings for evidence of that).
Just my $.02
Why do you think Im trying to convince anyone? People who are not convinced now that Trump is a fascist are completely lost and trying to reason with them is a lost cause. Same with people who vote for the fascist party AfD in my country. All we can try is to fight against these people at every point attempting to make them hide in shame again instead of publicly puking out their shit.
America deserves Trump. Period.
Y’all love your violence outside your borders. How about within?
Reading the report makes me feel like I’m from a different planet.
It clearly spells out Israel blocking aid to Gaza. It describes what we all would call blocking aid. If someone did what Israel does, to you, you would call it blocking. Israel blocks aid and the report makes it plain.
Just because they have a different definition of “blocking aid” doesn’t mean the report cleared Israel. I don’t get it. Can you really just say whatever you want, end it with “but it’s not what it sounds like” and that’s the takeaway everyone gets?
It’s one thing for a document to have arbitrary restrictions on what it can say. That happens. It’s another for people to take it so literally.
Edit: I don’t even know what definitions they were working with, I just got a “it’s not technically…” vibe. But I do know that the report describes blocking aid.
Not the first, and won’t be the last.
Article mentions 5 other State Department employees have left over Biden’s support of a genocide while pretending it’s not a genocide.
It’s not to late to ditch him for a candidate that represents the values of dem voters. And regardless of who it is, they probably have a better chance of stopping trump.
Sunk cost fallacy is a terrible way to run a political party, but especially when the stakes are this high.
Even if we win and get four more years of this, it’s not winning, it’s just losing less. Which is why Biden’s numbers are so bad, he doesn’t inspire voters due to his words and actions.
No, Biden has the brand recognition and is the party’s best chance to win. His administration does do a terrible job of selling the good things he is doing and he is shooting himself in the foot by not following through on his ‘red line’ with Rafah, but that isn’t enough of a negative to outweigh the lnown factor.
It sucks that winning a first past the post election based on the electoral college is how it works instead of something like ranked choice, but that is where we are at.
Biden isn’t going to win dude. He’s losing, hard L style right now.
Its not an issue with fptp, its not strategic voting.
He’s a shitty candidate that was always a comprise/ most-least preferred candidate and he’s not going to win.
Continuing to make the arguments that we need to stick with Biden is basically arguing to give the election to Trump.
He’s a shitty candidate [who] was always a [compromise?]/ most-least preferred candidate and he’s not going to win.
Shitty compared to whom? To the leading republican? Are you high?
So what’s your solution? Who has a better shot at winning the election in November if they started campaigning today? I want a specific name and why you think it would work. You know better than everyone, this should be easy for you (everyone else, watch for this sidestep and refusal to actually answer or back up anything).
You’re really good at claiming (almost to a point of preference) that Biden will lose and why we shouldn’t support them but not once have you provided anything of value that people can take action on. Everything you post appears to be designed to make people more apathetic and less likely to be involved, why is that?
Article mentions 5 other State Department employees have left over Biden’s support of a genocide while pretending it’s not a genocide.
It’d be nice if we could have a presidency where no one from the State or Justice Departments quits in disgust during their term. The last time was what? The first Bush?
Who is this candidate? Pick one and start saying their name! Would Sanders take the nomination? Whoever it is, you’ll need their cooperation at least, so find your duck and get it in the row.
I don’t mean to yell at you, it is frustrating and humiliating for the average citizen, and it’s going to get worse.
Losing less is still better than losing more and if we’re too late we have to accept that and look beyond the vote to damage control in the coming years. Yes, asking each other to “hold your nose and vote” sucks, but we’ve got to pair it with the idea that protest and disobedience and local government action is going to be an important factor for years to come, no matter who is president.
and if we’re too late
That argument worked in 2016, it’s been 8 years of trump…
If the party can’t find a single better candidate, than maybe there should be different people leading it?
But pick any of the 49 senators that caucus with Dems (I’m not counting Manchin, he’d probably be just as hard to elect as Biden) and they’d all have a better shot.
Hell, AOC would get every single Dem vote that can’t hold their nose for Biden. And while some “moderates” would campaign against her like they did Obama, as we saw back then increased turnout more than makes up for those conservatives who constantly claim compromise always means giving them exactly what they ask for Maybe less, but never more.
The main voter block this election will be under 40, we can’t keep catering to boomers because our politicians are so old they can’t realize their grandkids are now the biggest demographic.
We’ll always be little kids to an 82 year old.
Biden is part of the old boys club where all the monied interests hang out. If you think AOC will get their support you’re not thinking of the current USA. Politics in USA is owned by corporations and I haven’t seen her back corps, why would they back her?
It’s not to late to ditch him for a candidate that represents the values of dem voters. And regardless of who it is, they probably have a better chance of stopping trump.
I’ve been saying this for months. Years even. If you want Trump to lose, its not going to be with Biden.
If you want Trump to lose, its not going to be with Biden.
…again. Trump has already lost to Biden once in 2020. If anything Biden has a 100% track record of beating Trump in presidential elections. Trump has a 100% loss rate against Biden in Presidential elections.
Biden wasn’t supporting a genocide of the Palestinian people in 2020.
Things are different for incumbents than they are for challengers, especially those without a recent track record.
In 2020, right now in terms of days till voting day, Biden had something like a 15 point lead on Trump.
Biden barely won going into election day with a massive lead.
Its 2024. Biden lags Trump by 3-6 points.
Its over. Biden loses. He can’t make up that kind of polling deficit.
“The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”
George Orwell, 1984
