What would you have me do? All I can do is vote against it.
If you don’t have a lot to fear from a right-wing dictatorship I guess all you can do is vote against it.
If you’re someone who does have something to fear from a right-wing dictatorship, begin thinking about preparations to hide, run, fight etc. because unsurprisingly every right-wing dictatorship has a high body count.
Still hoping common sense wins out, and unlike a lot of other countries that went dictatorship the military doesn’t have the same relative power and authority, but it’s best to have some plans for the problems that could occur.
The most influential person in politics is you. Openly speaking out to your family and friends about the danger of Donald Trump is the best method of his defeat and the preservation of our democracy. All politics is local.
Oh yeah, a lot of good that will do against the propaganda machine with billions of dollars to spend and a whole apparatus of disinformation to use. But, I’m sure my uncle who has gotten angry and cussed me out over politics will surely change his mind this time
You should look up Deep Canvasing. That technique is actually very effective at overcoming personal biases, and it’s a big reason why there was a huge public shift with regards to gay rights.
The propaganda machine isn’t omnipotent, as much as it would want you to believe that.
That’s exactly how the propaganda machine wants you to feel and speak. Parent comment is right. You are the one with the power. Exercise it as if you might lose it if you don’t!
Time for the people of the US to do some kind of a peaceful overthrowing of the system
Have you ever seen a peaceful overthrow of a government before? I haven’t.
We cant expel sex offenders and insurectionists from government, you think you can peacefully overthrow the whole thing?
Sideeye from the voting booth
Goes back to voting
If you don’t think we can win in the voting booth, we can’t win nonviolently, and we probably can’t win using violence, either. Voting is the non violent way to change things.
To win we just need to look at the success of the teabaggers. They ran people at the bottom - school boards, county positions and local city councils. It took about ten years for those to move up the power chain to congress. Of course they achieved power through the backing of tons of very wealthy conservatives, state-of-the-art propaganda and experts at cheating, sprinkled with borderline violence.
That’s all you can do. Also, talk to everyone you know. Mention Project 2025 and it’s goals. Encourage people to register to vote. Light fires under asses. Get mad about it NOW. If Trump gets elected, America is super fucked.
I’m in a super red area, if I encourage more people to vote Trump gets more votes. But everyone around here is so unbelievably brainwashed I just gave up. I’ll vote but I can’t do much else about it.
We’re not sleepwalking into anything.
There’s an increasing number of people who are sprinting towards it at top speed, an increasing number of people willing to let it happen because they’re mad at Biden over Israel or upset that he’s not the embodiment of the perfect candidate, and then those of us who are blaring the warnings from our bullhorns, only to find that half the crowd is blaring right along with us and the other half has no interest in what we’re saying.
“Biden’s old and Israel is bad now, so clearly the obvious solution is to vote for a Trump dictatorship. Surely that’s the most common-sense solution and absolutely nothing can go wrong. The leopard certainly won’t eat my face, right? Right???” – an increasing number of independent and Democrat voters
Also, a lot of the media wants a horse race and wants their clicks, no matter the risk. And they keep bothsidering Biden and Donnie.
I believe it was actually CBS that openly admitted to this because of how profitable it is. Like it or not, Trump is correct in his statement that a lot of these news networks are raking in record profits by hanging on every word he says as if it were a biblical proclamation. News comapnies across the board are going to see huge hits to their bottom lines once he’s out of the public spotlight.
The party is dogshit at messaging and has no intention of even trying to get the votes of the people you described.
The principal concern at the moment seems to be preemptively finding a group to blame if Biden loses. Imagine if that energy and focus were put into trying to win votes.
TBH I would understand if he was smart, scheming and charismatic. Instead, they are rooting for a buffoon, an idiot and a failed businessman. He was even in power before, and they still want him back.
The folks who say never Biden are right wing operatives. Perhaps unwittingly in some cases, but I suspect many of the loudest voices don’t want to see any Democrat win and running down Biden is their best shot at that.
The folks who say never Biden are right wing operatives.
I wouldn’t be so sure on that.
Disclaimer: Admittedly, this is my own anecdotal experience, which should be given as much weight as any other anecdotal evidence from some rando on the internet. But I have talked to people who are saying exactly that. I haven’t heard any of the “he’s too old” bit, but I do know of independent voters who intend to hold their nose and vote for Trump even if they don’t like him because they’re letting their opinions on the Israel situation cloud their judgement. Granted, I live in MA and they live in right-leaning areas of the state so their protest vote for Trump won’t change a thing since MA is one of the bluest states in the country.
It’s the independent voters in states like Michigan that I’m worried about, because it won’t take many of them to flip some of those states red.
You clipped that to imply I said all of them when I absolutely didn’t. I also am an independent in Michigan. I can’t make promises but I’m seeing vehement enthusiasm for voting blue among the swing voters I know. Admittedly it’s anecdotal.
I don’t want to see any Democrat or Republican or anyone win that is beholden to private entities rather than the people.
It’s all a fuckin show and has been for over 100 years. It goes back further than that but at least we were mostly free of it prior to 1900.
You and me both. It’s a sad state of affairs that it’s not even an option. How we vote and the two party system is written into the fucking Constitution (not as such but the parties become inevitable) and we have to live with it. It’s supposed to be a living document reacting to changes in the times but that’s not possible right now.
I get not wanting either party. I’m certainly not beholden to either of them. But we are stuck. And we can fight one battle at a time to slowly move things in the direction they need to go even if it’s one step forward and two back, or we can give up and just find a way to live with whatever chaos and injustice others choose for us. Because right now there just isn’t another option. Maybe some day if we fight hard enough and we win often enough we can win better options for the future, but they probably won’t be for us. The road is long and the progress is slow.
Ahh, yes. Just completely disregard any criticism of the Democratic Party as “right wing operatives.” It couldn’t possibly be that they abuse their position as the only other viable option in order to further their plutocratic goals, and the people who have been complaining about it for decades are simply tired of hearing “it’s not the right time” ad nauseum.
You know what will convince people who barely managed to vote for Hillary in 2016 and Biden in 2020 to vote against their conscience yet again? Knowing that they’ll be instantly blamed anyway when the majority doesn’t get their way? Insults and baseless accusations.
Criticize away. I’m no democrat and I have no love for them. I get into disagreements with those on the left about various things I disagree with. But at the end of the day I can work with democrats and I can’t with fascists. Defending freedom and the constitution against tyranny is something I swore an oath to do, and I will vote for nothing but democrats as long as fascism looms here.
If you’re advocating voting for anyone other than Biden, you are a de facto right wing operative. That may not be the intention, but that’s absolutely the result. It’s not an insult, it’s simply math.
There is no viable alternative to Biden for the 2024 election. Not a single one. Push Biden and the Democratic Party left, don’t campaign against them unless you want the GOP to gain more control. That’s unfortunately the reality of a FPTP system. Something like ranked choice voting would be a great way to change that. Guess which party is actively fighting against increasing representation and voting access? The very same people you’re electing when you sit out or vote 3rd party. If someone can explain to me how Biden losing the election is a net positive for the country I’m all ears.
How is protecting the queer community, women’s rights, and the civil rights of PoC, voting against your conscience exactly?
@MagicShel I know this is hard to understand, but genocide affects our decision making, and some of us would even prefer our country to fall to complete ruin than be aparty to it. Never again isn’t “never again unless it would be politically expedient”
Do you understand what I mean? That there are lines that can never, ever be crossed?
Do you understand why I’d never be able to look in the mirror again after that?
So you think that the default is no genocide? No genocide is not an option here. Our realistic options are:
A) genocide
B) genocide + fascism at home
Not choosing defaults to B
If you think Trump is going to bring a halt to genocide you’re delusional. Vote Trump in and the genocide will continue or escalate. The GOP will escalate persecution of your countrymen and will further dismantle our democracy.
All the shit Trump did, locking kids in cages, rampant corruption, constant stream of lies, bungled foreign policy, stochastic terrorism. None of that crosses the line for you.
Or is it that you’re more about the symbolism of your vote than its real world effects?
We aren’t committing genocide. We oppose genocide in Ukraine, and we would allow it under Trump. The fact that you’d be fine letting this country burn doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. We can’t help anyone in that state. And a lot of us want to help.
Look, I will hold my nose and vote for Biden in the general, just like last time. But don’t pretend that he had any business running again.
I’m not gonna vote for anyone because I’m way too left to agree with a lot of their politics, I’m just gonna vote against Trump. It doesn’t matter who is running against him, I’m not letting that dipshit win again. Or the republican party in general at this point, they’ve gotten too crazy.
Centrist City here I plod
I said before, and I’ll say again, Biden is this generation’s Jimmy Carter. If the GOP were to have put forth any competent candidate in 2020, I think Biden would’ve lost by a landslide. Same goes in 2024. Not that I agree with her policies, but given the current political climate, I think the advantage would go to Nikki Hailey if she were to get the nod. But if the choices are (A) Donald Trump, and (B)…it doesn’t matter what B is. Go with B.
The race seems to be narrowing on Her with her Koch dollars, Ramaswamy as the wild card candidate, and Trump because the man’s ego is too large to leave the race even if he ends up in jail.
Oddly enough, that’s all we ask for. Vote with your heart in the Primary. Be as passionate for change as you can be. But in the General, vote with your brain and for the Democrat. Tell yourself it’s a vote for the lesser evil. Tell yourself that any vote besides the winner of the Democratic Primary, whether that be Biden or somebody else, is a vote for Trump, just like it was in 2016 and 2020. And no matter how much you have to hold your breath while voting, make sure that in November of next year, that vote goes to the Democrat, whoever he is. That’s all we’re asking.
The best thing about Biden and Israel, is he’s doing nothing different than any other president since 1948. Trump was the one who moved the American Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem ffs.
He’s actually kinda better on Israel than previous presidents, he’s been negotiating the release of palestinians being held hostage in Israel, and has secured Gaza the right to access their own natural resources, which Israel had been blockading.
Almost like he’s actually doing the thing the left accused him of disregarding and using the US’ good terms with israel and israel’s dependency on the US as a negotiating tool to keep things as clean as possible without Israel going completely off the handle and doing something like firing a nuke out of feeling completely isolated.
It’s one of the things I really don’t understand about the argument. I can understand why people are upset with Biden, but yet yadda yadda yadda over the fact that Trump is literally running on a platform of being exponentially worse to them. Tell them they’re cutting off their own nose to spite their face, and they respond by sharpening the blade.
I am throwing in the towel for now. I am hetro white uppermiddle class male of prot background and can quote the Bible better than most preachers. I am in zero danger. It is everyone else is who is fucked. The rest of this country can’t even bother to vote to save themselves from firing squads.
The funny thing with an outgroup is that it keeps growing. They’ll find something they don’t like about you.
Biden’s old and Israel is bad now, so clearly the obvious solution is to vote for a Trump dictatorship.
It’s full Bernie Bro logic too. Bernie didn’t get the nomination, so we’re voting for Trump.
These people don’t care about policies, only personalities.
You know, they are not sleepwalking. Its pretty intentional. Hitler’s had a large following…in the United States. They even had a convention once.
You don’t understand. The right WANT to be ruled by a dictator.
Republicans are a minority, but the right is the overwhelming majority. America has no mainstream left, its firmly center-right with a center-right party and a fascist party.
Make no mistake…. They’re WIDE AWAKE and doing it.
“He’s not hurting the people he needs to be hurting”
– A real quote by a real Trump voter.
They know what they’re voting for, and will be so surprised when it happens to them too.
I’ve said it once, and I’ll say it a million more times: the average American, who never received adequate education due to the erosion of the American education system over decades of Republican cuts, doesn’t know a damn thing about political ideology. “Fascism”? Is that like if you don’t like someone’s face?
Making a lot of assumptions about my intentions here aren’t you?
I’ll go let my gov know they didn’t teach me enough “old-men-only” USA political theater.
🇵🇸 Enjoy the Military Industrial Complex I suppose 🇵🇸
You are one of the people dangblingus was mentioning about the erosion of the Education System. Here, let me help out.
Suppose you’re voting in an election for who is going to be responsible for the Christmas Decorations this year. The rule is the person with the most votes wins. There are three candidates. One person thinks that Christmas is a commercialised holiday that sucks money out of you. He’s saying that the community should NOT put Christmas decorations up, and instead, put that money into the pockets of the homeowners. Let’s call him Mr. Bah Humbug. The other person LOVES Christmas, and wants to put up decorations. We’ll call him Jolly Saint Nick, but your big problem with him is that he isn’t that inclusive. You love Christmas decorations, but you think that he should put up decorations for other Winter holidays as well. And thus, you don’t want to vote for him. So you put yourself up as the alternative to Jolly Saint Nick. Let’s call you Progressive Jim. And you’re going to cause the entire community to get NOTHING. How? I’m getting to that.
The community is narrowly divided on the question of decorations. There are 200 people on your block. 99 of them want to keep the money in their pocket, while 101 want decorations in the community. The 99 are all unified. There’s not much room to debate specifics in that position. All 99 want to keep their $$$ in their pocket. So there’s no vote splitting there. But you have ALREADY split the vote in the 101 side. What happens if you and two other people vote for you? Well, 99 people are voting for keeping money in their pockets. 101 people wanting SOME sort of decoration, minus your three votes, equals 98. The final breakdown is 99 Bah Humbug, 98 Jolly Saint Nick, 3 Progressive Jim. Congrats! You just ensured that NONE of the 101 people who wanted Christmas Decorations get what they want. You let the Perfect (having inclusive holiday decorations) be the enemy of the Good (having any sort of holiday decorations), and now you get the worst outcome of all, nothing at all.
In this system, you have to come to a consensus you can deal with. All the people who want decorations are just going to have to come together and negotiate on the type of decorations, and the thing is that in a democracy, you don’t always get what you want. You have to settle with ‘good enough’ if you want to get anything done. Another analogy used here is voting is like taking the bus, not falling in love. If you insist that you must get EVERYTHING you want, in First Past the Post, you regularly get NONE of what you want, especially if you’re the ‘fall in love’ party like Progressives are, and you’re up against a “Fall in Line” party like the Republicans/Conservatives.
There are fixes. Maybe you make your voting a Ranked Choice system, so people can specify “my vote for a progressive holiday season not tied to Christmas is not a vote for no decorations at all. If I don’t get what I want, I’ll settle for uninclusive decorations, grudgingly.” But that’s not the system we have. And until we do, Nic Cage is right. All you’re doing here is ensuring we get the worst outcome.
